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The "Doc fee" scam.....

jmrtsus

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Doc fees? What are they? Basically additional profit for the dealer. They will try to say it covers all the paperwork for the car, like writing a check to Ford to pay for the car, the "massive" amounts of government documents to prepare (taxes once a year). I don't know any other business where you pay them to give you a sales slip, do you? Pay them to pay their suppliers (one check a month)? The only fee that should be charged is a reasonable fee for your tag and title, it does save you the time and effort. Normally the dealer collects the sales tax and applies for your tag and title for you for a fee of anywhere from $50 to $1000. Yes, I said $1000 dollars, Autonation in the Atlanta area tries to tack on a $1000 dollar Doc fee!

Doing some research I found many states have legal limits on what the dealer can charge, obviously Georgia is not one.

What can you do about it? Do not over pay it! Just make sure you negotiate a bottom line price NOT a price on the car alone, do not agree to a car price THEN have "local market price adjustments", "Doc fees" "Shipping charges" (already in the MSRP), window engraving, various interior and exterior coatings or nitrogen in your tires. One dealer in TN added a very official sounding line item labeled "non taxable fees" and another lower down labeled "taxable fees" explained as "government fees we pay" (lie), plus protectants and such added on. I have seen people bragging about buying a car for thousands under cost........but paid thousands in additional markups and a took a major beatdown on their trade!

I deposited a check with a full refund on my doc fees yesterday. Why did I pay them? I didn't in the sense that I paid what was a good bottom line price to me and extremely low according to Truecar and other pricing guides for the car with the fee added. In my case the dealer collected the tax money and fees when I bought the car but a month later sent me a check for the taxes and fees and told me to get my own tag and title. I went nuts on the Ford Customer support people. Long story short since all they provide was only the paperwork that was required by law I threatened to sue for fraud. The overnighted me a full refund. However if they HAD done the tag and title I would have had no case. So after the almost $600 doc fee refund my car my car was now $600 cheaper! BTW, what a dealer has to provide in almost all states is a bill of sale, proof of ownership of the car, in the case of a new Ford it is called an "Origin Certificate" and an odometer statement.

So watch your bottom line, if a dealer adds an outrageous doc fee then you should demand a lower car price and shop...shop....shop that price around and make sure they know you are price shopping at multiple dealers. Use the web and phone and do not step foot in the dealers door until you have a check in hand for the negotiated price. This prevents "forgotten or overlooked" charges being added. DO NOT take your checkbook with you! Have the financing check and your portion already made out from the bank. Too many times a dealer will find another couple of hundred that they can add without fearing you walking away. Having pre filled out checks stops that silliness!

Always keep in mind that a car dealer has one goal in life. To separate each and every customer from as much of their money as possible. Your goal is to steal a Fiesta ST for as little as possible. Two opposing goals.....do not believe for one minute anyone at that dealer has any other goal than maximising the money changing hands. And in case you did not know most dealers will NOT be very honest with you.....some recent examples...

"The ST is a rare car we cannot sell them under sticker." Nashville TN Sales Manager

"The ST is so popular we have to add a $750 "local Market" price adjustment to the car." Knoxville TN Dealer.

" Everybody has to pay the $1000 doc fee, it is required". (by who?) Autonation Atlanta, GA

"We can't get them (ST's) except with the Recaros and Nav System." Another Nashville, TN dealer.

" We can't discount this car, they are so rare you will not find another for hundreds of miles." Had to point out their were 19 in Atlanta alone! Another Atlanta dealer.

I sold cars and my three brothers sold cars.......look on the reverse of your sales agreement and you will normally find in the fine print where the dealer disavows any and all promises and statements made to you by any employee unless they are written on the sales document!

Prior planning on the price you are willing to pay with the options you want is paramount. Do your homework and the money you save will let you do the mods you know you will do! And don't fall for the "doc fee" scam!
 


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jmrtsus

jmrtsus

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Thread Starter #3
Me too but the rest of the story is I did not really get the money back from the sale. It seems that the dealer has a fund called "Customer Satisfaction fund" required by Ford and used to "resolve" Ford initial survey complaints......so the gave me the money to "fix" my initial survey! Whatever! That covers new SS brake lines, RMM, and the Mishi intake!

I hope some new buyers take heed of what a dealer can do to you if you are not aware of the tricks of the trade. BTW, I would kill for a ride in your Shelby!
 


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I am an Internet Sales Manager In the Central Valley of California and I just bought an ST, our DOC fee just covers the DMV Fees for the State. We also Sell our New Cars close to Invoice.
 


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jmrtsus

jmrtsus

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That is good to hear we have dealers with some ethics.....cannot say that about the South Central area. Here they might as well hang a skull and crossbones flag at the dealer's front door!
 


me32

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Me too but the rest of the story is I did not really get the money back from the sale. It seems that the dealer has a fund called "Customer Satisfaction fund" required by Ford and used to "resolve" Ford initial survey complaints......so the gave me the money to "fix" my initial survey! Whatever! That covers new SS brake lines, RMM, and the Mishi intake!

I hope some new buyers take heed of what a dealer can do to you if you are not aware of the tricks of the trade. BTW, I would kill for a ride in your Shelby!
Yeah dealers actually make profit on the doc fees. In ca they tend to range from $20-$80 bucks. Plus you pay the normal tax and fees to the state and DMV.

If you weren't so far away id have no problem giving you a ride in the Shelby.
 


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Worked for one of the largest/highest volume new car car dealerships in America for about 2 years. The fee that is BS is the dealership fee. I never pay it and suggest anyone buying cars to fight it. unfortunately more and more dealers are now saying it is mandatory so the outlook is bad for the customer.
 


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jmrtsus

jmrtsus

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Thread Starter #8
People need to understand "mandatory" is a favorite word of a dealer......nowhere does FORD or LAW say you have to pay it. You have to ignore it and negotiate a bottom line price. I see Doc fees as just another ploy to make you think you are getting a"deal" when they drop the price. Many people are just too ignorant to understand they add Doc fees, Advertising fees, taxable fees, Non-taxable fees....all made up charges to inflate the price by thousands so they can show you how they knocked $2000 off the sticker. Years ago it was "undercoating", Paint protectant, alarm systems, window engraving, fabric treatments......anything to add to the sticker to take off for a "deal"When in reality you are paying MSRP or higher for the car...... People seem to think a car dealer exists to "work" with you. No, they work you over. Car buying is not a repeat sales business today.....the salesman and sales manager will be long gone by the time you are ready for another new car. They just want one shot at you!

Car buying is a war.....you against them.......fight like they do, dirty! The only number to look at in shopping a car is the DELIVERED PRICE! Don't let them play the numbers game with you.....don't argue about individual charges like the DOC fees. Shop one dealers delivered price to another.
 




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