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1.0 for next ST?

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#21
There'll be 6 speed manuals and there is talk of offering it with some form of automatic transmission. I hate when they put training wheels on enthusiast cars. If you want a sporting autombile, you should be able to drive a manual. I know more and more manufacturers are doing away with manuals and using SMG, DSG, PDK etc and that they are quicker than the manual cars, but there is something to be said for driver involvement. I love rowing my own gears especially when you have a nice gearbox at your hand.
Totally agree. The problem is people like to race cars on paper and numbers sell. Being a decent driver and having my last 4 vehicles equipped with a 3rd pedal I can tell you DCT's are great in the 1/4 mile or drag racing in general. Other then that they are not needed. The VIR record was set in a Z06 manual and that's with GM even stating the auto is faster, plus the driver missed a shift lol. On a track the speed difference is minimal as you loose very little speed to shifting if you drive it correctly. The fun factor is undeniably different between the two.

Not to mention I can't think of anything else that drops panties faster then a butter smooth heel toe downshift around a hairpin [cool]
 


Waterfan

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#22
So the next gen FiST is rumored to get bigger, heavier, and have a smaller/more strung out engine?

The more that comes out about the next gen, the happier I am with my 2015 model, jeez.
The new FiST would have to be significantly lighter (~2500) for me to consider a 1.0T.

One good thing about 1.0T, better F/R weight bias. Might make it better overall better in handling, but low ceiling on power mods is a big letdown.
 


Rhinopolis

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#23
That video of the "3T" (three cylinder turbo) in the Formula Ford is great, and although the ceiling for performance is lower than our 1.6 I might rethink my criticism of the idea if Ford puts the right package together.
 


M-Sport fan

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#24
As would I :). You can add this one to the list of forbidden across the pond vehicles :( Call me crazy but I would DD a vehicle like this, as long as weather permitted of course [raceflag]
I would NEVER call you crazy for that, as I would daily drive (in everything except deep snow) a 900 to the wheels NA (7liter C5/6 R, ITB equipped and unrestricted, ALMS Katech built engine), Xtrac sequential equipped Z06 if I had the coin, and could find a state with NO inspection whatsoever to drive it in. LOL ;)

(Among other equally insane kit.)
 


M-Sport fan

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#25
That video of the "3T" (three cylinder turbo) in the Formula Ford is great, and although the ceiling for performance is lower than our 1.6 I might rethink my criticism of the idea if Ford puts the right package together.
It's a great little engine, it's just that Ford marketing/design would put it in something WAY TOO heavy, and stick their LOUSY DCT slushbox behind it or to the side of it. [nono] [:(]
 


M-Sport fan

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#26
The new FiST would have to be significantly lighter (~2500) for me to consider a 1.0T.

One good thing about 1.0T, better F/R weight bias. Might make it better overall better in handling, but low ceiling on power mods is a big letdown.
They would have to offer a 3 door version, at ~2300 lbs. LOADED in order to get me into one. ;)
 


M-Sport fan

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#27
There'll be 6 speed manuals and there is talk of offering it with some form of automatic transmission. I hate when they put training wheels on enthusiast cars. If you want a sporting autombile, you should be able to drive a manual. I know more and more manufacturers are doing away with manuals and using SMG, DSG, PDK etc and that they are quicker than the manual cars, but there is something to be said for driver involvement. I love rowing my own gears especially when you have a nice gearbox at your hand.
I could live with a 'proper' and REAL SMG gearbox/transaxle, like in the Bimmers, Ferraris, etc. (but it would be MANY $$$$$$$ added to the list price [:(]).

Ford's DCT crap, on the other hand, is about the worst transmission they ever made, NOT only as far as performance driving goes, but even in outright reliability as well.
 


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#28
I would NEVER call you crazy for that, as I would daily drive (in everything except deep snow) a 900 to the wheels NA (7liter C5/6 R, ITB equipped and unrestricted, ALMS Katech built engine), Xtrac sequential equipped Z06 if I had the coin, and could find a state with NO inspection whatsoever to drive it in. LOL ;)

(Among other equally insane kit.)
Thank you :) You wouldn't be the first, I have seen my fair share of vettes with snows lol

I use to thrash a Katech Z06 sometimes C6 LS7 around 650hp I believe. Full Moton suspension, nicely cammed :). It was a customers car who raced GT3, he even won at Daytona. He would let me take it out and give it a beating [;)] This is how I would want a Z06. For comparison I had another Customer (use to work at Chevy) with a 427 C6, took out the LS7 and put a 427 crate engine then supercharged with Meth. I would take that Katech Z06 over the 427 any day.

Just uploaded this on Youtube lol

[video=youtube;B83DyhYbQ0A]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B83DyhYbQ0A[/video]

BTW Florida doesn't require any inspections, too early to retire lol
 


M-Sport fan

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#29
NICE!^^^

But I am speaking of the actual ITB intake (NOT factory style manifold) LS7.R engine out of the GTS/GT1 ALMS Vettes, which made almost 700 to the wheels with a HUGE inlet restrictor in place.

Katech claimed that it would be good for ~900 to the wheels without those said restrictors in the intake snorkels.

Obviously nowhere even near street legal, and probably not even 'streetable', but that would not stop me (and why the need for a NO inspection state). [wink]

It would have the 3 way adjustable Penske reservoir coil over dampers on it, every suspension and weight saving trick in the book, and the widest wheels/tires that could fit under the Pratt & Miller carbon fiber body work/flares, as well as that completely un-streetable XTrac sequential with a tiny, featherweight, AP 3 disc carbon racing clutch, and no weight flywheel.

The only 'road condition' I would avoid like the plague is stop and go traffic jams! LOL
 


Rhinopolis

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#30
This engine could inspire me to fall in love with some tiny cars. Can you imagine the potential success of a car like a modern day Honda Del Sol if fitted with an engine such as this? A buddy of mine in college had the 96 Del Sol Si with the 1.6 Vtec, and we had a blast driving in that thing and couldn't care less that it was only made for two. "Sucked to be you" if you were the third person out...lol.

I'm totally daydreaming right now and I'm envisioning a fun to drive platform at under 2200 lbs fully wet, nothing frivolous and equipped for driving enjoyment, and with this engine tuned for 180/180. A lightweight and non frivolous roadster is what I keep coming back to, and something very simple like the 2000's Toyota MR2 Spyder.

Ford is making me lust after cars right now, and I'm impressed with the momentum that they are carrying [twothumb]
 


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Sherwood Park
#31
The fact the new Fist is likely to be bigger in itself makes me glad I have a current generation car. If I had wanted bigger, would have gone for a Fost. It seems each generational change of most cars always means bigger. What made the original car attractive is often lost. Every now and then a manufacturer 'gets it', that bigger is not the way to go such as Mazda with the current ND Miata. Most manufacturers would have made it S-2000 sized or BMW Z3 sized, so full credit to them for getting the car back closer in size and weight to the original Miata.
What they might be able to do with a hopped up 1.0 3 cylinder is intriguing though, but as others have stated, the Fist would need to be a lot lighter to make it shine.
 


BronxBomber

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#32
The fact the new Fist is likely to be bigger in itself makes me glad I have a current generation car. If I had wanted bigger, would have gone for a Fost. It seems each generational change of most cars always means bigger. What made the original car attractive is often lost. Every now and then a manufacturer 'gets it', that bigger is not the way to go such as Mazda with the current ND Miata. Most manufacturers would have made it S-2000 sized or BMW Z3 sized, so full credit to them for getting the car back closer in size and weight to the original Miata.
What they might be able to do with a hopped up 1.0 3 cylinder is intriguing though, but as others have stated, the Fist would need to be a lot lighter to make it shine.
Ford has stated it will be about same size and still be on B segment architecture, so it shouldn't be much bigger if at all.
 


M-Sport fan

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#33
This engine could inspire me to fall in love with some tiny cars. Can you imagine the potential success of a car like a modern day Honda Del Sol if fitted with an engine such as this? A buddy of mine in college had the 96 Del Sol Si with the 1.6 Vtec, and we had a blast driving in that thing and couldn't care less that it was only made for two. "Sucked to be you" if you were the third person out...lol.

The problem with the Del Sol was that if there was ever a car which looked like it should be mid-engine and RWD, THAT was it.

I'm guessing it was still somewhat fun to drive even front engine and FWD due to it's size/weight, but seems disappointing for being that.

There was a TOTALLY riced-out one in the neighborhood where I used to live in Joyzee.
 


M-Sport fan

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#35
^^^Hard to tell with all of the camo, but the front fascia looks very Volvo-ish, and the tail lights look like a Hyundai.
 


BoostBumps

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#36
Interesting comparison between "next gen" Fiesta 1.0 test mule verses 2018 Fiesta ST test mule spied earlier this year - Note IC placement between the two...

Point being aside from the article posted by OP in this thread speculating that the next gen ST may get a 1.0L engine most other articles previously posted also speculate the next gen 2018 Fiesta ST will remain 1.6L with larger IC which we do see in the 2018 ST Mule pics...

I suppose more will be revealed fairly soon as further details are released early next year...Design wise I wouldn't be surprised if Ford borrows some front end styling cues from the RS ...

[HR][/HR]

Fiesta 1.0 Turbo Test Mule

SPIED: "Next Gen" Fiesta Test Mule?

Fiesta 1.0.jpg
[HR][/HR]

2018 Fiesta ST Test Mule

2018 Next-Gen Ford Fiesta ST Spied

2018 Fiesta-ST Mule.jpg
 


M-Sport fan

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#37
Yeah, strange that they would mount it vertically like that, but it does not block any of (or VERY little of) the radiator in that position.

That turbo must be nano sized, even compared to our stocker, given that I've seen oil coolers more than twice the size of that IC. ;)
 


CSM

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#38
Not buying this at all. Hot hatch market is growing, if they all of a sudden take away some HP from the specs of one of their best sellers they are going to lose market share to other competitors.

I'm thinking that there will be:

  • Base model (NA)
  • "sportier" model - A sort of middle of the range performance variant (1.0 ecoboost)
  • ST version (1.6 turbo?)

Yes Ford has tuned the 1.0 motor for ~200hp, but I believe there is definitely concern over longevity and reliability at that level. Seems like I remember reading that the street version of the formula ford is tuned down below 200hp for this very reason.
 


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#39
If true, this sounds really cool! [twothumb]

I love small cars and I love the idea of driving a "slow" car fast. Wouldn't mind a dip in power so long as the handling and curb weight improve.
 


BRGT350

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#40
the current 1.0L has the vertical intercooler next to the radiator. Having driven the 1.0L with a manual transmission on a number of occasions, the engine is really impressive. Much like the normally aspirated 1.6L Fiesta with a manual, it is the gear ratios that suck the life out of the car. With a close ratio 6-speed, the 1.0L could be an absolute blast! The 1.0L also has a very impressive exhaust note for such a small engine. I do think this engine has some serious potential, after all, it is now the engine used in the rally Fiestas.

As far as a DSG transmission, I sure hope the ST doesn't come with one. Ford just announced the GT350 will come with one, so I would bet they will be showing up in the ST and RS shortly. I had a DSG Focus rental last week and it was a horrible transmission. Jerky, noisy, hesitates, and just awful. Every Focus rental I have ever driven has been a horrible car thanks to the transmission. I would take a traditional automatic over a dual clutch any day. A DSG is how to ruin a good car, but it is great for the kiddos who can't put their phone down long enough to change gears or for the internet racers who will tell you that their DSG is .0004 seconds faster on the 'Ring than my manual.
 


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