Livernois Motorsports Tune +18hp / +65tq

[allpurposeben]

Just do yourself a favor and drop that iPad in the toilet along with your other undesirables and you'll lead a happier and more productive life

Easy hater, keep that nonsense on the Android forums, not here.

 

[LILIKE16ST]

I would also like to know if i can account for different overall diameter tires with the mycal. I have been running the livernois 93 octane tune for a few months now and I love it. The peak to peak gains you hear about don't do it justice in describing how much different (a.k.a. BETTER) the car feels in every way when it comes to performance. Pulls hard compared to stock even several months later it often surprises me just how quick the car is to just have this tune and a k&n drop in and straight piped stock catback which probably do little to nothing combined so most of the difference in performance is coming from this tune with a little help from removing over 6 lbs per corner on my wheels and ditching around 100 lbs total off my already lightest optioned base st. However as I mentioned before and before I get off on any more rambling about how great livernois is (lol) I would also like others have mentioned like to know if you can account for different sized tires. When I got my team dynamics pro race 1.2 in 15x8 I went with the bfg sport comp 2 in 195/55/15 as it is a very wide 195...gives it a very slight stretch for optimal response (7.7 tread width on an 8 inch wheel is pretty much perfect in that regaurd) but another thing that sold me on these tires was the fact they were so close to stock diameter it's virtually the same. It might be a quarter of a mph off at 80 mph? lol...basically it's dead on. Tire rack said these tires have 887 revs per mile vs the 888 revs per mile they claim my michelin pilot sport as3 in 205/40/17 have (mine had the optional all seasons that I think started on the 16 model year). There are more variences between different brands of the same size tire or even within the same brand of the same size tire than 1 rev per mile that's virtually identical. I love these tires they do very well for my needs don't get me wrong...but if I was able to correct for different od on tires I probably would have considered some of the extreme summer performance tires in 205/50/15. I didn't want my speedo to be messed up or my mpg calculator and my odometer milage reading or any of that. However if we CAN account for and correct for different od on tires with the mycal on the FiST then I would highly consider some of those 205/50/15 my next go around on tires....maybe some star spec 2 are in my future Those would plain have more ultimate grip period (although these bfg arent shabby at all for a 340 treadwear tire) and the dunlops in 205/50 also weigh 2 lbs less per tire than the bfg sport comp 2 that's just icing ont he cake. I already saved over 6 lbs per corner with my current setup adding those would make it more than 8 lbs per corner off my stock setup. Livernois Motorsports please get back to us and let us know about this whole overall diameter correction situation. Thanks and sorry if I rambled a tad I tend to do that when I get bored. carry on...

 

[thePete]

Wow. What a read.
I'm heavilly leaning towards this tune due to the background in EcoBoost engines, and the obvious understandings of the differences in this PCM from other engine managment systems.

This Stormcrow guy (or girl, I suppose) doesn't seem to understand the fact that this PCM uses completely different logic to determine fuel tables and required boost and spark timing. Just because you don't understand what's going on doesn't mean it's wrong. You're a self-admitted enthusiast, questioning professionals with a longer history of tuning this specific engine platform than you have tuning anything. A 600hp 350 is fuck all. It's a build you can do with a few clicks of a mouse on e-bay. It's laughable that you think that's an accomplishment to hang your hat on, or grounds to bash them into the ground with long-winded and uninformed rants. There's a reason they don't use the same software as everyone else, and why they get way better gains. And they operate a business. If they're the only one in the game that can do what they're able to do with the factory PCM, why on earth would they want to reveal anything about how they do it? It frustrates me when non-professionals question the word of pros without the depth of knowledge to do so. A little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing.

This idea that a tune needs to be done for a specific area is also silly. They're not carburated engines. You say "well how can their tune that is written in Illinois work fine in Atlanta?" ...How can my car that was built and tuned by Ford work just fine in Vancouver, and the same car with the same factory tune work just fine in Florida? When you write the PCM programming to work as stock, with modified variables and calculation tables, guess what? You can make more power, while having it adapt and learn like a factory PCM. You don't have to retune a stock car just because you put a CBE on it, why should you need your tune re-written for it either? If your tune is so volitile that it only works properly in one approximate atmospheric condition, it's a pretty shitty tune. JDM ECU logic is practically archaic in comparison to an EcoBoost PCM, so it's not unreasonable that tuning houses who formerly specialized in JDM stuff aren't able to unlock as much with a PCM that they A) can't access or manipulate large portions of, and B) operates completely differently to what they're used to. Ford had to make this sellable, insurable, and safe enough that the 18 year old kid who convinced his mom it's "just a Fiesta" doesn't kill himself. Of course they left a lot on the table. That's the part that tuners take advantage of. Livernois just seems to have a much better grasp on how to do that than most of the other tuners. Doesn't make the other guys wrong, just makes Livernois better.

Also, fuel quality is of course important on a TDI engine, but DI engines get dirty because they don't spray fuel into the ports. The intake clogs and pollutes itself with blowby oil and the back side of the intake valves cake up. When we pull a head off an EcoBoost, the exhaust valves are usually cleaner than the intakes. A fuel system service won't fix that either. A catch-can and occasional vacuum induced intake cleaning with SeaFoam or something will. It's an issue common across all DI engines. Ford seems to be having better luck with it than a lot of others. Hyundai having some of the worst problems besides VW.

 

[BoostBumps]

NEW POLL: What Tune are you using on your Fiesta ST?

 

[M-Sport fan]

Question;

IF one were crazy enough to buy and install the whole Livernois package, while also owning an AP V3, could the latter still be used ONLY as a gauge package/monitoring, and data-logging device, or does the Livernois tune installation somehow preclude/prevent the AP from even being used for that purpose??

 

[allpurposeben]

Question;

IF one were crazy enough to buy and install the whole Livernois package, while also owning an AP V3, could the latter still be used ONLY as a gauge package/monitoring, and data-logging device, or does the Livernois tune installation somehow preclude/prevent the AP from even being used for that purpose??

I think this has been asked and answered. The AP has to be married to the car for the gauges or logging to work, this would overwrite the Livernois tune. By the same logic, the Livernois tune would overwrite an existing AP install.


Sent from my graphing calculator.

 

[M-Sport fan]

I think this has been asked and answered. The AP has to be married to the car for the gauges or logging to work, this would overwrite the Livernois tune. By the same logic, the Livernois tune would overwrite an existing AP install.

THANK YOU!

BTW; LOVE that avatar!

 

[allpurposeben]

No problem.

Thanks, I find that the Guard Duck and I are usually on the same page about most things.

I've been wrestling with the question of reading CAN data without the AP if I do decide to go with Livernois (waiting on first oil change and swapping off the stock tires before tuning). There are a few options out there for reading data off the bus but they all have some hangups either in performance, display type and features (honestly, I had a lot of the same hangups with the AP too).

I'm toying with getting a CAN bus shield for an Arduino and just building my own solution that will accomplish all the things I'd like to have specifically but that will be a new thread elsewhere on the forum if/when I do.

 

[allpurposeben]

On answers to my questions from posts 637 and 638, I emailed Livernois support but got some non-answers back. Basically, whoever is tier 1 support punted with a general answer of "I don't know, ask the tuners" but didn't offer to pass my questions on.

So if the person who manages the Livernois Motorsports account on this forum happens to be in the tuning department, maybe they'll get addressed, else I'll dig deeper.

I'd really like to explore their hangup with only offering the tune loading utility for Windows. It's usually a case of the guy who does the interface work doesn't do Mac but if they'd be willing to detail what the Windows client actually does (I've got an idea but need confirmation), I might be able to come up with at least a script to do it on Mac (and probably other flavors of *nix), if not a simple application. There's just no excuse for not supporting macOS in 2016 and I'd be willing to donate some time to solving that problem, expecially if it saves me the 100$ I'd have to spend on a Windows license and the time I'd blow installing Windows for just this one thing.

 

[LILIKE16ST]

Wow. What a read.
I'm heavilly leaning towards this tune due to the background in EcoBoost engines, and the obvious understandings of the differences in this PCM from other engine managment systems.

This Stormcrow guy (or girl, I suppose) doesn't seem to understand the fact that this PCM uses completely different logic to determine fuel tables and required boost and spark timing. Just because you don't understand what's going on doesn't mean it's wrong. You're a self-admitted enthusiast, questioning professionals with a longer history of tuning this specific engine platform than you have tuning anything. A 600hp 350 is fuck all. It's a build you can do with a few clicks of a mouse on e-bay. It's laughable that you think that's an accomplishment to hang your hat on, or grounds to bash them into the ground with long-winded and uninformed rants. There's a reason they don't use the same software as everyone else, and why they get way better gains. And they operate a business. If they're the only one in the game that can do what they're able to do with the factory PCM, why on earth would they want to reveal anything about how they do it? It frustrates me when non-professionals question the word of pros without the depth of knowledge to do so. A little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing.

This idea that a tune needs to be done for a specific area is also silly. They're not carburated engines. You say "well how can their tune that is written in Illinois work fine in Atlanta?" ...How can my car that was built and tuned by Ford work just fine in Vancouver, and the same car with the same factory tune work just fine in Florida? When you write the PCM programming to work as stock, with modified variables and calculation tables, guess what? You can make more power, while having it adapt and learn like a factory PCM. You don't have to retune a stock car just because you put a CBE on it, why should you need your tune re-written for it either? If your tune is so volitile that it only works properly in one approximate atmospheric condition, it's a pretty shitty tune. JDM ECU logic is practically archaic in comparison to an EcoBoost PCM, so it's not unreasonable that tuning houses who formerly specialized in JDM stuff aren't able to unlock as much with a PCM that they A) can't access or manipulate large portions of, and B) operates completely differently to what they're used to. Ford had to make this sellable, insurable, and safe enough that the 18 year old kid who convinced his mom it's "just a Fiesta" doesn't kill himself. Of course they left a lot on the table. That's the part that tuners take advantage of. Livernois just seems to have a much better grasp on how to do that than most of the other tuners. Doesn't make the other guys wrong, just makes Livernois better.

Also, fuel quality is of course important on a TDI engine, but DI engines get dirty because they don't spray fuel into the ports. The intake clogs and pollutes itself with blowby oil and the back side of the intake valves cake up. When we pull a head off an EcoBoost, the exhaust valves are usually cleaner than the intakes. A fuel system service won't fix that either. A catch-can and occasional vacuum induced intake cleaning with SeaFoam or something will. It's an issue common across all DI engines. Ford seems to be having better luck with it than a lot of others. Hyundai having some of the worst problems besides VW.

I agree totally with you and I'm glad you said all this you said it much better than I did or could. This tune is awesome these dudes know what they're doing...everyone is always wowed by my cars performance and as I mentioned I just have about 100 lbs total weight reduction so far including about 25 lbs off my wheels and tires and k&n drop in and straight piped stock catback with this 93 octane tune....it really woke it up. I want the dhm race cooler because the car tends to heat soak quicker due to the tune running more boost and holding more boost etc. I think that will wake up a little more power out of it honestly the stock cooler can't keep up with what this tune is capable of. I'm also going to eventually get a cold air intake to replace my drop in and a 3 inch catless DP to go with my stock diameter straight piped catback. I beleive there is some more power to ve had from just those minor mods and having this thing already in the low 2600 lbs range with a goal to get under that 2600 mark without removing the rear seat or ac this thing will have a decent power to weight ratio and does already. The overall power this tune gives is amazing but what is even more amazing is the very stock like smooth drivability when you stay out of it and it's improvement in overall increase in mpg from my mods as a whole in particular the tune. Ive been able to average 37-40 mpg several times on long trips with cruise set on 70 well above the factory rating. This tune is awesome hands down....

 

[vlangs]

I'm leaning towards this tune as well, primarily because I wanna "set and forget". It's my daily, I want a bit more power and torque and be done with it.

Thanks for all the info everyone