Cobb AP V3 vs. Mountune MP215

[timboslice]

Interesting. My understanding was that the MP215 (or any AP3) purchase included custom tuning revisions for 45 days. If I'm wrong then out makes it seem like a pretty horrible deal considering the additional $150 charge for custom tuning and the $580 premium over the Cobb Stage 1 package.

Yes, the MP215 kit does come with the upgraded airbox and drop in filter though. It's also a mod supported by Ford Racing so it won't bring any warranty claim into question. But yeah, it's a pretty big premium over the Cobb alternative in terms of bang for buck. You are really paying a premium for having piece of mind knowing that no dealer could deny a claim because you "tuned" your car. It's almost like having a factory tuned car.

I have the MP215 kit sitting in my garage. The kit needs to be installed at a dealership to register the warranty with Ford Racing. If I could go back in time, I would buy an AP from Mountune then wait for the right induction kit, intercooler, Dp and cat-back system then tell them I want the custom tune for my specific setup. I would then have 45 days to data log and for them to tweak my tune from the day they first sent my tune.

 

[dyn085]

I would slightly understand the premium if it included the Ford labor, but that's yet another cost on top of something that's already crazy expensive. Considering the fact you already have the MP215, now you have Ford labor and the additional tuning. Compared to the Cobb, you'll still have to buy a RMM as well...

Your back-in-time proposal is cheaper, but it removes the warranty possibility.

 

[timboslice]

Your back-in-time proposal is cheaper, but it removes the warranty possibility.

Exactly, any tune could potentially deny a warranty claim. Although the chance of Cobb stage 1 tune being responsible for any damage is highly unlikely, it could still happen. Also, some dealers are less mod friendly than others. The MP215 kit comes with the AP and the Mountune induction kit so its really only a ~$300 premium over Cobb stage 1 (I bought when Mountune had a pretty good promotion) but I won't be able to upgrade to another level of map.

I guess I'm comfortable with the premium as I get piece of mind with the warranty and I won't ever have to revert back to stock if I have to take my dealer in for service/recall work.

 

[timboslice]

Oh and to go back to MP215 vs Stage 1...

Here is the MP215 dyno Euro FiST (which might be different as theirs use a MAF sensor): 211 HP 243 ft/lb http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PSREYxc6iPg

VS.

TST's stage 1: 187HP and 247 lb/ft
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_v8BuB5RsI&list=PL0NpLqqFBFSJokevSgfJEgm-CXFw-sHRO&index=6

But they are 2 different dynos so any performance difference could be attributed to the variances in the dyno.

 

[StormTrooper]

Meh....Ill take the Cobb stage 1 with the RMM and spend the extra $600 plus shipping and pop on an FMIC, then compare numbers

 

[aballphoto]

If the Mountune tuner is warranty safe, how can the dealer tell the difference between a car that has been returned to stock tune with a Cobb or a Mountune? I know dealers can see that an ECU has been flashed, but can they see anything more than a flash occurred?

 

[iLiptiKal]

Kind of a moot point here. The dealer would know of the flash because they have to do it for warranty approval, and once done can't be flashed using the handheld unit. It has to be reverted to stock at the dealer.

Edit: You have to think of the mTune and COBB V3 as separate pieces of kit. The V3 you can change maps all you like and have custom tunes from numerous tuning shops, or diy with the PC software. The mTune is installed at the dealer to take advantage of the warranty provided by Mountune and Ford, and cannot be changed by the owner once installed.

Ford will absolutely be able to tell if you have tuned and you don't uninstall your V3. I'd say it's widely believed that ford can detect a flash, but I'm not sure how much info they can gather exactly. This is a topic covered all over other car forums and I've yet to see a definitive answer really, so go MP215 if you want to have the peace of mind of a warranty, and V3 if not.

 

[aballphoto]

Kind of a moot point here. The dealer would know of the flash because they have to do it for warranty approval, and once done can't be flashed using the handheld unit. It has to be reverted to stock at the dealer.

So the handheld mTune doesnt work the same way as the Cobb where you can flash it yourself? That doesn't seem right since I can buy it not through a dealer. And what if I went to a different dealership, there are about 15 within an hour of me.

 

[iLiptiKal]

So the handheld mTune doesnt work the same way as the Cobb where you can flash it yourself? That doesn't seem right since I can buy it not through a dealer. And what if I went to a different dealership, there are about 15 within an hour of me.

See my edited post. I was adding more info for clarity when you asked.

 

[aballphoto]

Kind of a moot point here. The dealer would know of the flash because they have to do it for warranty approval, and once done can't be flashed using the handheld unit. It has to be reverted to stock at the dealer.

Edit: You have to think of the mTune and COBB V3 as separate pieces of kit. The V3 you can change maps all you like and have custom tunes from numerous tuning shops, or diy with the PC software. The mTune is installed at the dealer to take advantage of the warranty provided by Mountune and Ford, and cannot be changed by the owner once installed.

Ford will absolutely be able to tell if you have tuned and you don't uninstall your V3. I'd say it's widely believed that ford can detect a flash, but I'm not sure how much info they can gather exactly. This is a topic covered all over other car forums and I've yet to see a definitive answer really, so go MP215 if you want to have the peace of mind of a warranty, and V3 if not.

What if i order an mTune to my door from MountuneUSA, I can't do anything with it without taking it to a dealer?

 

[iLiptiKal]

What if i order an mTune to my door from MountuneUSA, I can't do anything with it without taking it to a dealer?

You could install everything yourself including the tune with the mTune, but you wouldn't be covered by the warranty.

Also the mTune handheld alone is ONLY for people that have the Mountune induction kit installed by a Dealer already.

 

[timboslice]

Ford will absolutely be able to tell if you have tuned and you don't uninstall your V3. I'd say it's widely believed that ford can detect a flash, but I'm not sure how much info they can gather exactly. This is a topic covered all over other car forums and I've yet to see a definitive answer really, so go MP215 if you want to have the peace of mind of a warranty, and V3 if not.

This isn't even debatable anymore.. Any Ford tech can tell if your car's ECU has been flashed with a simple piece of diagnostic equipment. It's the same for just about any car with an OBDII port, I don't know why people won't believe it. It was posted on a FiST forum a few months ago too. What the dealer does with that information is up to that specific dealer. Some are cool, some are not..

 

[aballphoto]

You could install everything yourself including the tune with the mTune, but you wouldn't be covered by the warranty.

Also the mTune handheld alone is ONLY for people that have the Mountune induction kit installed by a Dealer already.

Thats exactly my point. Say I do that, then uninstall it, re-flash to stock and take my car to a dealer. Can they tell the difference between a Cobb flash and mTune flash?

One could also make the point if I'm flashing with a mTune, unless the dealership load a different file than the one I buy how is it any different? If I go to a different dealer that doesnt know my car how would they know if a dealer did it or not?

 

[iLiptiKal]

This isn't even debatable anymore.. Any Ford tech can tell if your car's ECU has been flashed with a simple piece of diagnostic equipment. It's the same for just about any car with an OBDII port, I don't know why people won't believe it. It was posted on a FiST forum a few months ago too. What the dealer does with that information is up to that specific dealer. Some are cool, some are not..

I wasn't saying "Ford cannot detect a flash", I fully believe that they can, I just haven't seen specific details about how much information can be read.

 

[iLiptiKal]

Thats exactly my point. Say I do that, then uninstall it, re-flash to stock and take my car to a dealer. Can they tell the difference between a Cobb flash and mTune flash?

One could also make the point if I'm flashing with a mTune, unless the dealership load a different file than the one I buy how is it any different? If I go to a different dealer that doesnt know my car how would they know if a dealer did it or not?

You can't uninstall the mTune.

 

[aballphoto]

You can't uninstall the mTune.

what? haha it's stuck to the car for life? What if I grow tired of it? If I get an mTune it's tuned forever? ....

 

[iLiptiKal]

what? haha it's stuck to the car for life? What if I grow tired of it? If I get an mTune it's tuned forever? ....

Yes and no. You can have a dealer revert it to stock and remove the Mountune induction kit that is part of the MP215 package.

 

[aballphoto]

Yes and no. You can have a dealer revert it to stock and remove the Mountune induction kit that is part of the MP215 package.

I'm not talking about the intake kit. just the Tunes.

So before Mountune had warranty approval, you still had to take the car to a dealership for them to uninstall it?

 

[timboslice]

I wasn't saying "Ford cannot detect a flash", I fully believe that they can, I just haven't seen specific details about how much information can be read.

Sorry, misread your post. Yeah it's a simple diagnostic I believe. I don't think it matters what they can read. If they detect it that can potentially deny a warranty claim or "red flag" your car. There's a leaked flow chart somewhere out there that describes the process.

 

[iLiptiKal]

I'm not talking about the intake kit. just the Tunes.

So before Mountune had warranty approval, you still had to take the car to a dealership for them to uninstall it?

Again you have to think of the V3 and the mTune differently. The mTune ONLY goes with the intake kit to make up the MP215. This is the only warranty approved ECU tune from Mountune, and must be installed and uninstalled at a dealer for said warranty.

The V3 is made by COBB and is sold by numerous vendors, some with custom tunes already loaded. If you order the V3 from Mountune you get 45 days of custom tuning through data logging and emailing the logs to Randy at Mountune USA. Any of these are detectable by Ford.