Stay in gear when stopping?

[dyn085]

Nope. He was driving a Scion TC (stock). Everyone in my family agreed with him so I figured it was normal to take off in 2nd gear. He also never downshifts. He just puts the car in neutral and coasts to a stop. I was just going to mimic him, but I guess I may need to reconsider. I appreciate anymore tips like these!

Yeah, that's just odd. Don't do either of those.

I had a '94 Z28 that had a skip-shift feature, and even with the gobs of torque that it had you still started in first. The skip-shift was from 1-4 for normal driving.

 

[Hijinx]

Nope. He was driving a Scion TC (stock). Everyone in my family agreed with him so I figured it was normal to take off in 2nd gear. He also never downshifts. He just puts the car in neutral and coasts to a stop. I was just going to mimic him, but I guess I may need to reconsider. I appreciate anymore tips like these!

Best tip I give is that you should practice getting the car moving without using the accelerator pedal; this will train you to find the "sweet spot." I do it every time I drive any manual car new to me, even if it's the same model.

 

[ed_the_sledd]

Best tip I give is that you should practice getting the car moving without using the accelerator pedal; this will train you to find the "sweet spot." I do it every time I drive any manual car new to me, even if it's the same model.

Sorry for my ignorance but what do you mean by this? Don't I have to accelerate to move the car? I'm guessing I turn on the car, put it in first, and then I move the car without the accelerator? Can I do this?

 

[Hijinx]

Sorry for my ignorance but what do you mean by this? Don't I have to accelerate to move the car? I'm guessing I turn on the car, put it in first, and then I move the car without the accelerator? Can I do this?

Absolutely. There's no sarcasm or anything in my statement. You'll feel where the clutch starts to grab; just go slow. If you'd like, PM me your email and I can send you a quick video.

Edit- I tried a quick video. Hope it gives you better idea.

https://vimeo.com/102744250

 

[ed_the_sledd]

Absolutely. There's no sarcasm or anything in my statement. You'll feel where the clutch starts to grab; just go slow. If you'd like, PM me your email and I can send you a quick video.

Edit- I tried a quick video. Hope it gives you better idea.

https://vimeo.com/102744250

Holy cow! I had no clue this was possible lol guess you learn something new every day. Thanks for the video! I'll definitely give it a try.

 

[Shmi]

Holy cow! I had no clue this was possible lol guess you learn something new every day. Thanks for the video! I'll definitely give it a try.

Yep! You can also shift gears without using the clutch but that takes a bit of finesse, although you can do it by just manhandling the shifter and pushing it towards the gear you want, I wouldn't recommend it lol.

 

[TheAndrew]

Yep! You can also shift gears without using the clutch but that takes a bit of finesse, although you can do it by just manhandling the shifter and pushing it towards the gear you want, I wouldn't recommend it lol.

This is true. Easy as pie in up-shifts, since the ST rev matches automatically. Shifts from 3-4 are totally clutch-less-able.

As far as downshifting while coasting... I leave it in whatever gear I was in until the revs get to about 1000, then press the clutch in before coming to full stop.

 

[geoffyb]

Yep! You can also shift gears without using the clutch but that takes a bit of finesse, although you can do it by just manhandling the shifter and pushing it towards the gear you want, I wouldn't recommend it lol.

I used to deliver car parts for a company. We never used the clutch in any of the delivery trucks. The Ford Ranger could handle it without a problem.

 

[Shmi]

I used to deliver car parts for a company. We never used the clutch in any of the delivery trucks. The Ford Ranger could handle it without a problem.

Yeah when I was a child my father and I were out in his 1986/87 Porsche 911 when the clutch gave out. He drove the next 200 miles home without it, though I don't remember it at all I have heard the story several times

 

[geoffyb]

Yeah when I was a child my father and I were out in his 1986/87 Porsche 911 when the clutch gave out. He drove the next 200 miles home without it, though I don't remember it at all I have heard the story several times

Gotta love old driving stories. I learned to drive on a 71 Vette that we had to hotwire to get going. I learned some valuable lessons that day. We didn't steal the car, it was just a quality GM product

 

[vegas_]

Perusing the Ford Owner website, under "fuel efficient driving tips" I read:

"Stay in gear when stopping
While shifting into Neutral and coasting to a stop sounds like it would save fuel, the opposite is true: Many modern fuel-injected vehicles go into a 'fuel cutoff' mode when the engine senses that the vehicle is in gear, the rpm is above idle, and the throttle is closed. Shifting to Neutral may cancel that mode, so keep it in gear."

The Manual for my Automatic Mustang had this statement which says basically the same thing,This statement was in the section of the manual about the Automatic Transmission

Your vehicle has been designed to improve fuel economy by reducing
fuel usage while coasting or decelerating. When you take your foot off
the accelerator pedal and the vehicle begins to slow down, the torque
converter clutch locks up and aggressively shuts off fuel flow to the
engine while decelerating. This fuel economy benefit may be perceived
as a light to medium braking sensation when removing your foot from
the accelerator pedal.

However I could find no similar statement in my Fiesta Manual, neither in the general Fiesta Manual nor in the ST addendum

So I decided to test, a long downhill run, I let it coast in 6th gear, foot off the accelerator, the instantaneous MPG readout on the dash is 99MPG
I shift to neutral, car speeds up a tad, MPG still 99

HOWEVER, with an OBDII adapter connected and reading instantaneous MPG using the Torque app on my phone there is a difference.
When coasting in 6th it reads 106MPG
When coasting in Neutral, it reads 150MPG

So it seems that coasting in neutral, at least with a manual transmission, is more fuel efficient.
I imaging it would not be possible to completely cut off the fuel for any car with a manual transmission,
if the fuel was cut off, and you shifted into neutral, the engine would stall.

 

[Manta Ray]

Hmm... I learned this around 2004. in gear coasting = fuel cut = 30+ mpg average. 36 mpg 2012 golf r and 28 mpg 2008 sti.

 

[dyn085]

The Manual for my Automatic Mustang had this statement which says basically the same thing,This statement was in the section of the manual about the Automatic Transmission

Your vehicle has been designed to improve fuel economy by reducing
fuel usage while coasting or decelerating. When you take your foot off
the accelerator pedal and the vehicle begins to slow down, the torque
converter clutch locks up and aggressively shuts off fuel flow to the
engine while decelerating. This fuel economy benefit may be perceived
as a light to medium braking sensation when removing your foot from
the accelerator pedal.

However I could find no similar statement in my Fiesta Manual, neither in the general Fiesta Manual nor in the ST addendum

So I decided to test, a long downhill run, I let it coast in 6th gear, foot off the accelerator, the instantaneous MPG readout on the dash is 99MPG
I shift to neutral, car speeds up a tad, MPG still 99

HOWEVER, with an OBDII adapter connected and reading instantaneous MPG using the Torque app on my phone there is a difference.
When coasting in 6th it reads 106MPG
When coasting in Neutral, it reads 150MPG

So it seems that coasting in neutral, at least with a manual transmission, is more fuel efficient.
I imaging it would not be possible to completely cut off the fuel for any car with a manual transmission,
if the fuel was cut off, and you shifted into neutral, the engine would stall.

The fuel definitely cuts off when coasting in gear, just read your afr.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

 

[Slurp812]

Perusing the Ford Owner website, under "fuel efficient driving tips" I read:

"Stay in gear when stopping
While shifting into Neutral and coasting to a stop sounds like it would save fuel, the opposite is true: Many modern fuel-injected vehicles go into a 'fuel cutoff' mode when the engine senses that the vehicle is in gear, the rpm is above idle, and the throttle is closed. Shifting to Neutral may cancel that mode, so keep it in gear."

This is news to me. What do you guys think?

Leaving it in gear or downshifting does "push" the engine, so fuel can be cut off. But you are also dragging the speed down as well. Saving fuel at the expense of momentum. I do all of the above depending on conditions. Slush box guys probably hate me when I let off and slow down while they have to drag the brakes.

 

[vegas_]

The fuel definitely cuts off when coasting in gear, just read your afr.

AFR ???
If fuel is cut off, then MPG should be infinite.

 

[dyn085]

AFR ???
If fuel is cut off, then MPG should be infinite.

No, if fuel is cut off then AFR is infinite.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

 

[letitreign]

Not that it really matters, but technically...your both right, but you're also both wrong. Both the MPG and the AFR would only approach infinity, since neither the MPG nor the AFR could be resolved with a 0 denominator. That being said, I fully down shift all the way to 2nd, and then I let it cruise to a stop since 1st is such a short gear.

 

[Siestarider]

Just read the entire thread. Having worn out pilot/throwut bearings before clutch disc in two cars in the past, '69 Lotus Elan and 66 Corvair Corsa, both 4 speeds, I try to limit the amount of time I spend with clutch disengaged at a stop. If I have to pull clutch assembly for repairs, I would just as soon it be clutch plate worn out and replace throwout bearing assembly at same time. Then again, I expect modern clutch assemblies are more resistant to bearing wear than older systems.

I agree with being situationally aware and in a gear that is useful for maneuvering when you need it. Mostly I coast in gear until its time to select a lower one. Skip gears all the time, both up and down on street, and blip throttle for multiple down gear skips just to be kind to drivetrain. Always go to neutral with clutch engaged for full stops, except when quick acceleration is likely called for from a stop.

My priority is being kind to the car on street so mechanicals last. On track, when trying to extract minimum lap times, I will use flat-foot upshifts and heel toe downshifts, try to get brakes to do as much of the work as possible.

Main thing is to always drive as smoothly as possible while being aware and ready to change quickly as needed by circumstances.

 

[vegas_]

Sadly Torque does not display AFR only instantaneous MPG

 

[Slurp812]

+1

Agree 100% I prefer to use a little more fuel and save my clutch.
I used to use the engine to brake back in the day until someone pointed out that replacing the brakes was generally cheaper and faster than replacing the clutch. Ever since it's brakes only. I leave the car in neutral and use the parking brake in every car I own every single time.

My other car is a 5 speed 2002 Civic si. Downshifted almost every shift. Original clutch. 205,000 miles. Be gentle most of the time!