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Cracked camshaft?

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#1
Ok... Here's a new one for me. On second FiST and multiple engines because of cooling issues... And now this 2016 is overheating. Diagnose a bad head gasket then upon replacing they call to tell me the camshaft is cracked! Huh? Now need a whole new head! Can't wrap my head around this one. Lots of experience with cars but never even heard of a cracked cam. I'm sure it had nothing to do with the cause of the overheating though for sure.
 


TyphoonFiST

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#2
Ok... Here's a new one for me. On second FiST and multiple engines because of cooling issues... And now this 2016 is overheating. Diagnose a bad head gasket then upon replacing they call to tell me the camshaft is cracked! Huh? Now need a whole new head! Can't wrap my head around this one. Lots of experience with cars but never even heard of a cracked cam. I'm sure it had nothing to do with the cause of the overheating though for sure.
Is it modded?

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Intuit

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#6
If it's the camshaft that was somehow cracked, why would the head need to be replaced? Do you mean cracked head rather than cracked camshaft?

Camshafts aren't really in a position to experience a lot of stress.
 


OP
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Thread Starter #8
If it's the camshaft that was somehow cracked, why would the head need to be replaced? Do you mean cracked head rather than cracked camshaft?

Camshafts aren't really in a position to experience a lot of stress.
Exactly! And they confirmed cracked camshaft.
 


OP
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Thread Starter #9
I'd bet they loosened the cam caps in improper order and valve spring pressure snapped it.
Precisely what I think too. But they're denying that. I've been there done that before on an Audi 1.8 myself. That would explain the reason for the new head because the cam caps are probably milled on the head.

Now they are saying they are waiting for new lifters too! Hmmmmm....
 


me32

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#10
Precisely what I think too. But they're denying that. I've been there done that before on an Audi 1.8 myself. That would explain the reason for the new head because the cam caps are probably milled on the head.

Now they are saying they are waiting for new lifters too! Hmmmmm....
Arent the new heads pre assembled?
 


Truth in Ruin

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#11
Precisely what I think too. But they're denying that. I've been there done that before on an Audi 1.8 myself. That would explain the reason for the new head because the cam caps are probably milled on the head.

Now they are saying they are waiting for new lifters too! Hmmmmm....
F that. Iā€™d tell them that I want a new engine.
 


OP
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Thread Starter #12
Soooooo.....heres the latest. Car back together now but the story is quite different than i was led to believe. Tech notes below.

My thought....the head was replaced and timing incorrect causing valve to head contact breaking cam....and now I'm pissed!

Thoughts?

VERIFIEDT CODES P0217 P0219 P0303 FOUND
COOLANT LOW RELITIVE COMPRESION/POWER BALENCE PASS.
ENGINE HOT PERFORMED COOLING SYSTEM PRESSURE TEST DROPED
4 PSI IN 3 HRS.REMOVED SPARK PLUGS BORE SCOPED FOUND COOLANT
COMING IN CYLINDER 3 AT HEAD GASKET AREA.REMOVED CYLINDER
HEAD INSPECTED HEAD AND BLOCK PER GSB 0000161. NO PITS
SUFACES EVEN.CLEANED AND REPLACED CYLINDER HEAD GASKET
PER WSM 303-01C.WHILE DURING ENGINE START UP THE INTAKE CAM
SNAPPED
IN HALF REMOVED VALVE COVER INSPECTED BOTH CAMS APPEAR TO
HAVE A FLAW IN THE CASTING
AND IMPERFECTIONS IN BOTH CAMS.WHEN CAM BROKE BENT VALVES
AND CRACKED THE HEAD AT THE CAM CAP ON THE INTAKE
SIDE.REPLACED BOTH CAMS TAPPETS AND CYLINDER
HEAD PER WSM 303-01C.CHANGED OIL AND FILTER BLED AND FILLED
COOLING SYSTEM CLEARED ALL CODES TEST DROVE RESET MISIRE
PROFILE CORALATION RECHECK FLUID LEVELS TEST DROVE CK OK
MO43930
 


OP
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Thread Starter #13
What are the odds that TWO camshafts bad in same engine? Haven't heard of any cam problems with the 1.6 and this engine has TWO?

What kind of force must there be to break a camshaft and the camshaft journal cap mount? And bend the valves? Not sure of any other way this could happen.
 


Dpro

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#14
Question it all falls under drivetrain wareanty and they fixed it why upset? I would never take it back to that dealer .....But as long as they fixed it and did not charge you and the car is good again? Well then youā€™re ahead of the game as you have a fresh top end.
 


OP
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Thread Starter #15
Why so upset? Well considering this is the third ST engine that has failed under 60k, that set the tone. Yes, it's covered under warranty until 60k and it cost me nothing except having the vehicle in the shop for two weeks. The damage is being portrayed as a manufacturing problem which is almost an implausible thing as they described it. PLUS....if the damage occurred on startup, I would inspect the bottom end if it we're me for signs of bend rod, wrist pins, etc, which may not show up right away...AND THEN there's the fact that they are still unable to state why the engine overheated in the first place just like engine #1 and engine #2. My patience was exhausted when I lost about $4000 on the 14 First when I got rid of it and now I'm in exactly the same issue again.
 


Dpro

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#16
Why so upset? Well considering this is the third ST engine that has failed under 60k, that set the tone. Yes, it's covered under warranty until 60k and it cost me nothing except having the vehicle in the shop for two weeks. The damage is being portrayed as a manufacturing problem which is almost an implausible thing as they described it. PLUS....if the damage occurred on startup, I would inspect the bottom end if it we're me for signs of bend rod, wrist pins, etc, which may not show up right away...AND THEN there's the fact that they are still unable to state why the engine overheated in the first place just like engine #1 and engine #2. My patience was exhausted when I lost about $4000 on the 14 First when I got rid of it and now I'm in exactly the same issue again.
Ok I get the frustration and upset. Why did you get rid of the 14 in the firsr place? I am assuming you lost 4k on depreciation . Well that happens when one buys a new car and turns it over in a couple of years.

As far as 16ā€™s go per discussion here depending on when the build date was it could be earlier than the cutoff date for the head issue.
Are you planning on getting out of this car now because of these issues? I am not sure were you are chalking up being 4k out again.

You seem to doubt Fords explanation for the problem and are quick to second guess them.


It also sounds like you have absolutely zero trust in the dealerships workmanship.

I canā€™t blame you for that but why are you not taking this up with Ford customer relations?

You are venting here and ya we feel you and understand ghe frustration but ultimately you should be talking to your state and Ford about lemon laws.


Possibly also consulting an attorney none of which is here.
 


OP
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Thread Starter #17
So, yes. I'm venting some and also seeking input from others. This isn't my first rodeo. I have been in contact with Ford Customer Service since day 1. They call every week to ask if I've heard from the dealer then pester the dealer for info that I already am aware. I have a great relationship with the dealer (purchased 20 or so cars from them since 1992) and have no bad history with their workmanship but each visit isn't evaluated based on the previous. Something happened here during this repair that doesn't seem right. The service rep is even shaking his head at this.

Just so you understand the history of the 14. It's been documented on this site in detail in other posts but here are the highlights.

2014 purchases FiST. At 20k started overheat condition which persisted until diagnosed at 63k. In and out if dealer for over a year. Dealer unable to duplicate problem when in shop because it only occurred with ambient temps over 90 which was also not duplicated when they had it. At 63k Ford engineering published a new leak down test for the head issue on these cars and mine was finally diagnosed with a bad head, then bad engine. I was told it was not covered because it was out of warranty even with weeks out of service during the warranty period. Had to fight with Ford to get it covered and still had to pay a deductible for replacement. After weeks in shop, new engine starts overheat condition at first ambient temperature over 90 within weeks. Considered it all a fluke and traded in at major loss for new "revised" 16. And the cycle now continues.

My car assembled AFTER the supposed "revised" head as was engine that was put in the 14.

Lemon law in MI doesn't apply to this situation so no help there.

Not a fan of lawyers so avoiding that at all cost.

To be perfectly honest, I can't imagine most people being as patient with this process as I have been, but I'm at the end of my patience with a car that I absolutely LOVE.

My hope is that some of this info will help others in this situation to understand what their up against when their car starts to overheat.

I will know more in an hour or so after I pick up the car and see the parts.
 


OP
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Thread Starter #18
And one additional item. Although the dealer was unable to diagnose the root cause of the overheat condition, they still replaced almost every component of the cooling system ( water pump, thermostat, hoses, solenoids, etc) over the numerous times it was in the shop over the year.
 


OP
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Thread Starter #19
UPDATE..

Just picked up car and took it 4 miles before once again overheating and going into limp mode.

Back at dealer now....
 


Ford ST

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#20
I don't understand why they don't test the hell out of this car, before they get it back to you. I'm sorry you have had such bad luck.

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