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Recreational track day report: Carbotech pads, RT700 brake fluid, Quaife LSD, BC coilovers, etc.

meFiSTo

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#1
I was not entirely sure where to put these notes, but figured this to be as good as any subforum here. Comments are anecdotal.

Event: March 28, 2015 Alfa Romeo of Oregon lapping event at Portland International Raceway.
Weather conditions: Cool (highs in the low to mid 60s), dry, partial sun
Driving style: Recreational lapping, not competition
Car setup: Build thread summary
My prior experience at this track: I've been out with half-dozen or so different groups about 25 times at Portland International Raceway, but this was my first event in the new car. My prior car was also a mildly FI'd FWD Ford, so this was not a radical shift for me. I sold it in 2012. It was nice to get to know a new car on a well understood course.

My experience on this day:


  • Carbotech XP8 pads -- The XP8s held up very well. I did not brake late very often, so was pretty easy on them. No fade and excellent stopping power when requested (on the few occasions when I asked for a little more and later braking power...chasing down cars).
Here's what they looked like after 3 15-minute a.m. sessions and 3 20-minute p.m. sessions:

Passenger side front


Driver side front


The Torque RT700 fluid and Stoptech brake lines seemed to perform very well. No fade, steady, progressive brake response and great grip when called for. No complaints whatsoever.

The stock calipers seemed to hold up well, but again, I did not cook the brakes. A more aggressive driving style, featuring consistently late, hard braking could heat things up significantly. YMMV.


  • Quaife LSD -- This road coarse really only calls on the LSD in a couple of spots (link to track map). Exiting Turn 2 (main straight chicane) an exiting Turn 7 (basically the entry to the back straight). I tried 2nd and 3rd gear exit on both, and really 2nd gear carried more speed and the car pulled straight with no diff-related, off-wheel spin. Very glad I added the LSD.
  • BC Racing coilovers -- I set these up with a relatively mild setting (10 clicks off full stiff). Car was very responsive. I am thinking that, for the next event, we'll add a couple of clicks of stiffness and push the car a little more. But on this day, the suspension did everything I asked. It even did a little oversteer 4-wheel slide exiting the chicane in 2nd gear on one or two occasions (chasing or running from fellow lappers). I had the tiniest amount of negative front camber (about -1 deg) accommodated by the H&R camber bolts. More negative camber is undoubtly going to result in even better grip, but this car is a street car and I drive it to the track. Happy.
  • 205/50-15 NT01s -- I love these tires. Very grippy (for what they are). While they do not communicate much (are not noisy at the limit), they do lose traction in a very progressive, manageable way. Love them. Same material as Toyo RA1s. These are the cheapest R-compounds you can buy (new). I know there are RA1 takeoffs that can be had cheaper, but these worked very well and are now nicely heat cycled! The width is comparatively mild, but for my use, they work fantastic.
  • MP215, mountune FMIC, mountune induction hose, infamous Turbo Transformer -- It's hard for me to distinguish how each bit contributed, but I found this very mild set of adjustments to work great together. What Fiesta ST owner does not want more power no matter what mods they have? Having said that, this setup had plenty of scoot for my fun recreational lapping application. I was not going to keep up with a Palatov D2 that dropped into our group, nor could I stay with the STi. Both just pulled on me in the straights (D2 also handled like a go cart, so I was not going to keep up with him back in the turn complex either). But the Fiesta had plenty of pull to get by when I found cars that could not get away from me in the curvy bits (and that had to let me through). That's all I ask for with this car -- enough power to execute a safe pass with some authority. I don't generally try to get away from cars that are catching me (depending on the situation and car). They are often faster cars or better drivers -- or both. One last note: In comparison to my old, similarly powered FWD car, this car seems to have better corner exit scoot (I attribute that to the EcoBoost's torque curve in the low- to mid-range). That works well when closing on a fellow lapper and trying to execute a safe pass.

Summary

For me, this stuff is all about having fun on track days and getting home safely. This car's combination of power, drive train, suspension, brake, and wheel/rubber adjustments is nearly perfect for my usage. It is not a fast car, but it's quick enough to hold its own with the many comparable cars found at typical track days -- and find plenty of open track. It'll never keep up with the GT3s, Palatovs, and the like we see at local events, but I'm confident it'll perform every bit as well as my old heavily modified FWD car. That's plenty for me.
 


OP
meFiSTo

meFiSTo

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Thread Starter #3
Did we just become best friends?
YEP !!
Lol.
Thanx for the report :)
Wait. Wut? My car is just a stealthy track rat. Yours is a big honking tire peeler. How can we be best friends? I'm happy to be friends, it's just that my little HPDE thing is frightened by your squealing Cyborg devil. It would be like my happy little pug wanting make nice with a snarling Rottweiler chained to a stake in the middle of a neighbors yard. Oscar would be scared. He would probably pee right there on the floor looking out the window. My car? It would leak brake fluid sitting next to yours.
 


Sourskittle

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#4
Actually, not really at all... Unless I wanted to stop every 30min for fuel, I'd have to run 93octane. Because my car is Tuned to the max now, i would have to de-tune it a bunch for consistent and safe power. No meth injection... There goes more power. In the end, I'd end up with 230whp-240whp at almost every useable rpm, but I'd also toast my bone stock brakes in 1.5 laps. My $76 tires have no thread at all right now ( like zero ), and even if they did, they don't corner as fast as stock tires. My stock suspension would not let me keep the same cornering speed either. So really..... Who's care would be faster? Not sure about that track, but my home road course is Sebring; and its murder on brakes.

My power output would also likely cause more heat and I'd have to do a cool-down faster than you.

Just say'n... Faster isn't always faster :)

Now.... 1/4 mile racing for one pass? Ok... I prob got you covered, but that's not what your doing with the car.

I like realistic expectations :)
That's also why I tried to keep everyone very informed of the parts on my car as the power progressed. Repeatable, realistic expectations :)

Only 2 places I'd have you on the race course would be the biggest straight, and my car does exit corners insanely smooth since my car/ turbo doesn't "donkey kick", lol. Just lean on the throttle and smooth consistent power on exit.
 


RAAMaudio

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#5
Great report!

Having a well sorted out, well balanced, easy to drive, quick enough for real fun......kind of wished I had done as you have to yours!

I really was going to stay very mild with my car and just go have fun and sometimes wish I had done that as I have worked on it 100 times more than drove it so far....I got a bit carried away but now I have to finish it and see what it really will do, of course, it will be fun but would of been more tame as well.
 


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#6
Great write-up - thank you! How are the XP8s for daily driving in cool temps (40's)? Work OK at the first stop? Work OK after 1 good stop? Or never really work well at 40F on the street?

Considering these pads for track days, but I'd prefer not to switch back and forth for daily driving. I don't mind dust and noise as long as the brakes are there even when it's a little cool out.
 


OP
meFiSTo

meFiSTo

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Thread Starter #7
Well, I don't like to use them during the off-season, so they generally go on before my first track day (late March to late May) then come off after my last track day (end of August to early October). This is not my daily driver so if I encounter cold temps when they are on, I just avoid driving the car. But the main reason I swap them out is to preserve them for as long as possible.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 


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#8
Great track report, very informative since Im in the similar mindset. Ill be out at MSR-Cresson near Fort Worth in earlier Feb, with a full assortment of new toys (MR230 kit (minus the backordered exhaust), Mountune RS-R brake kit with Stoptech Rotors, Motul 660, Deadhook crash bar, Ford Racing wheels, Bridgestone RE-11s, and Mishimoto Radiator/Oil Cooler,) since taking my car out stock in earlier November. Last track day led to catastrophic overheating issues that basically ruined my second day due to going into limp mode every lap and a half. Hopefully the rad, oil cooler, and crash bar will remedy that. Im stoked to see how the car performs. Ill add to your observations once I get out there in a couple of weeks.
 


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#9
I swapped to XP8s before my first track day but they were so damn noisy (LOUD squealing) on the street afterward that I had to swap back to stock. I was wondering if it was because I didn't bed them in properly beforehand? Have you experienced this?
 


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#10
I swapped to XP8s before my first track day but they were so damn noisy (LOUD squealing) on the street afterward that I had to swap back to stock. I was wondering if it was because I didn't bed them in properly beforehand? Have you experienced this?
The amount of noise is likely not due to improper bedding technique but because of the nature of a high performance brake pad. Kinda just comes with the territory. If you improperly bedded in your brakes you would feel a shudder through the steering wheel while braking. It happened to me at my first track day and it is very noticeable (and disconcerting). The noise is just a trade-off for being able to work at +1000?.

Carbotech does NOT recommended XP8 as a daily driven street pad due to elevated levels of dust and noise.
^from Carbotech's website about the XP-08
 


Siestarider

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#11
Thanks to Fiestatex for bringing this mature thread back to life. I copied Mefisto's format for track reports, this one remains a classic. My experiences are consistent where we overlap.

Curious, I mounted a used WW BBK last year, put the XP-10 pads on, after a few minor issues sorting them, have three track days and 8 months of DD on them. No noise, no braking surprises on street. Has not dropped below 45 yet this winter, maybe that has a lot to do with it.
 


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