Totally stock Fiesta ST. Taking a track school - what do I need to worry about?

[GypsyBagelhands]

Is there anything that I should address before the track school? The only thing I've done to the car is putting the stock tires on a new set of wheels. Do I need to worry about putting in higher temp brake fluid, replacing some of the coolant with water wetter/water? Several years ago I took my 86 corvette into a track school(at another track) and experienced brake fade with Porterfield R4S pads and Superblue, but the car weighed a LOT more than the little Fiesta. What tire pressures are you guys running?


Thanks for the input!

 

[willsolo]

You don't really need to worry about much. I've run 4 track days, 2 of them being basically stock. And when I mean stock, other than running Amsoil Synthetic oil, I'm still running the same Ford coolant (just made sure to top it off), stock brake pads and rotors and stock brake fluid. I wouldn't worry about it too much. If it's hot at the track you are going to, just make sure after your session to pop your hood to let the engine cool.

As for tire pressure, I'm running 30 PSI all the way around off a recommendation from [MENTION=1650]Pete[/MENTION]. I met him at one of the first track days I did, and I've been comfortable running that tire pressure ever since. Hopefully this helps!

 

[WhiteFords]

I have been successful doing open track events with a mostly stock car. ATE brake fluid, Stoptech lines, and Boomba deflectors seem to be keeping brake issues at bay. Be sure to turn the traction control off before each session, otherwise, the nannies use too much braking and really get things hot.

An AP3 is nice to have, not only for the increased power and throttle response, but to monitor the actual coolant temps. The stock 'guage' is really a three step idiot light.

These cars are very capable all stock. But then the track bug hits and it is very tempting to start adding parts to get faster.

 

[5nowman]

I have been successful doing open track events with a mostly stock car. ATE brake fluid, Stoptech lines, and Boomba deflectors seem to be keeping brake issues at bay. Be sure to turn the traction control off before each session, otherwise, the nannies use too much braking and really get things hot.

An AP3 is nice to have, not only for the increased power and throttle response, but to monitor the actual coolant temps. The stock 'guage' is really a three step idiot light.

These cars are very capable all stock. But then the track bug hits and it is very tempting to start adding parts to get faster.

How do you like the brake deflectors? Would like to add those before my next VIR weekend.

 

[WhiteFords]

I have no data to compare the Boomba deflectors to the stock splash guards. After watching Boomba's video showing them in action on a FOST, and knowing that Porsche has done similar things to 993s, I am certain that I get much better cooling than with just the splash guards deleted. There was one Boomba customer that claimed his brake dust was worse with the deflectors, but I noticed no difference in brake dust.

 

[FiestaTexas]

Let us know how it goes! Ill be trotting out my ST in October at MSR Houston running it entirely stock except for some new shoes (Bridgestone Potenza RE-11) on Ford Performance rims so I like to read all the feedback I can.

 

[OffTheWall503]

I concur with everyone elses post. It also wouldn't hurt to have your heater running that way you prevent possibly overheating.

 

[meFiSTo]

It depends a little on your driving style. I saw from the PNW forum that you plan to go out with the multi-club women-only day at The Ridge at the end of the month.

I think you've got the right idea. Cooling of the brakes and cooling in general are the areas to think about.

Do you have a lot of experience? Are you going to attack the braking zones? Are you going to stand on the throttle coming out of every corner? Having a sense of how you will drive will lead you to what you should do. If you are going to take it easy in the novice group and only will be doing one event this season, you probably need do nothing. At some point, if you want to do several events and hone your driving (drive faster, dive into braking zones, etc.), you'll want to consider a few minimum mods at least.

With our tiny stock radiators, distilled water/water wetter is not a bad idea. My experience is the car runs a little cooler with water/water wetter vs. the stock anti-freeze. It's a cheap adjustment and maybe even worth doing for the one event (since it might be warm). However, IMHO, I'd flush that at the end of the season and keep 50/50 AF-distilled water in there for winter.

My advice to my niece's husband, who is new to track days, was to swap in braided SS shielded teflon brake lines, quality brake fluid, and stout pads. He's got a FoST. Again, those are relatively cheap adjustments, and will help against brake fade tremendously. I like Torque RT700 and Carbotech XP8 pads. Motul RBF600 works fine. Castrol SRF is the gold standard. I think the Torque stuff is the best value (best wet temp rating for the $$$). There are a number of pad options, but I've had good luck with Carbotech over the years.

Hope to see you at the track some time. There is starting to be a critical mass of track-interested FiST folks in the Seattle area and maybe we all could coordinate connecting at one of these events some day. Maybe next summer. The Ford folks have the Mustangs NW Roundup every year. That includes a track day at Pacific Raceways. Pacific Raceways is only an hour from Seattle, although The Ridge is an order of magnitude more pleasant to drive.

 

[M-Sport fan]

I like Torque RT700 and Carbotech XP8 pads. Motul RBF600 works fine. Castrol SRF is the gold standard. I think the Torque stuff is the best value (best wet temp rating for the $$$). There are a number of pad options, but I've had good luck with Carbotech over the years.

The good folks at Torque would challenge the bolded above, with their "superior reserve alkalinity" argument, despite the world class, sky high wet boiling point of the SRF.

G-Loc is now making pads for our cars.
They are the people who helped start Carbotech, and recently broke away to start a new company.
When I go to change pads, the G-Loc GS-1s (equivalent to an AX6) are what I am going to try (for street use), along with their R6es/R8s (~XP-8 equivalent) for tracking when I get around top that.

 

[BRGT350]

When I had the 2014 Fiesta ST for the Fiesta Movement, I ran it at Nashville Motor Speedway on the road course and a few test sessions at GingerMan Raceway without any issues. The brakes stayed solid for the entire session and no overheating. We followed up the track events with 35 laps and 7 drivers at an autocross on the hottest day of the year without any issue. I did spray the intercooler down with ice water between autocross runs. In two weeks of track and autocross events, we needed another set of tires.

Fiesta ST GingerMan June 2013 105 by Bryan Redeker, on Flickr

 

[Rhinopolis]

This is a good thread and I would like to take my car to a novice track day event sometime in Oct. I've never messed with changing out coolant or brake system components before.

1. When changing out coolant to water/water wetter and then back to 50/50 AF/water, is it as simple as draining out the fluid and then adding more? Do I need to do anything "special" such as when I bleed out the brake fluid?

2. When replacing to uprated brake lines, how difficult is it to do this and where are the brake lines that are replaced located at? Would I start at the brake fluid reservoir in the engine bay and follow back from there?

I appreciate any advice and I would definitely like to uprate my stock braking system with higher quality components as well as upgrade to a better cooling coolant mix before I hit my 1st TX track session.

Thanks,

Ryan

 

[BRGT350]

This is a good thread and I would like to take my car to a novice track day event sometime in Oct. I've never messed with changing out coolant or brake system components before.

1. When changing out coolant to water/water wetter and then back to 50/50 AF/water, is it as simple as draining out the fluid and then adding more? Do I need to do anything "special" such as when I bleed out the brake fluid?

2. When replacing to uprated brake lines, how difficult is it to do this and where are the brake lines that are replaced located at? Would I start at the brake fluid reservoir in the engine bay and follow back from there?

I appreciate any advice and I would definitely like to uprate my stock braking system with higher quality components as well as upgrade to a better cooling coolant mix before I hit my 1st TX track session.

Thanks,

Ryan

Honestly, I would leave the car stock and run it. Chances of having a problem at the track go up exponentially once you start changing things. The best and more enjoyable track events for me have been with 100% stock cars. You aren't going out there to set FTD or a new track record, you are out there to learn the car and enjoy being out on track. The Fiesta ST is very capable right out of the box, in fact, it is far more capable than 90% of the people driving them. My brother and I ran the Fiesta Movement car very hard, way harder than I would run my own cars, and we never had a single issue. A number of others in the program ran at Sebring and Horse Thief Mile without any problems. Those were 100% stock cars and being ran very hard. Leave the car stock and focus on learning and managing the car on track.

 

[meFiSTo]

1. When changing out coolant to water/water wetter and then back to 50/50 AF/water, is it as simple as draining out the fluid and then adding more? Do I need to do anything "special" such as when I bleed out the brake fluid?

2. When replacing to uprated brake lines, how difficult is it to do this and where are the brake lines that are replaced located at? Would I start at the brake fluid reservoir in the engine bay and follow back from there?

The only problem for the coolant, I believe, is that I don't think the stock radiator has a drain valve. Since it's always my shop that does that stuff, I'm not 100% sure. If not, then you could disconnect the lower coolant hose to drain. Have a bucket or bed pan or something ready, right? Not sure if that will drain the reserve tank. Any way you can get the fluid out will do the trick. Gravity draining when possible is always nice. Any friendly shop, even the Ford dealer shop, should be happy to give you pointers, eh?

As for the brake lines, they are the lines right at the brake calipers. There's one per caliper. StopTech, FSWerks, and mountune have them for sure. I think the Goodridge lines for the ST180 work for our car, but you'd want to check. I have the StopTech ones. They're all pretty comparable. Again, use something to catch the brake fluid, then refill and bleed.

On race cars, I think these are considered wear items, so every year it's worth inspecting and probably swapping out as needed. Having said that, I had the same set on a 2004 SVT Focus for 7 years of pretty frequent tracking and never changed them.

This pic more or less shows the brake line (at right) assembled to the the right front caliper

Honestly, I would leave the car stock and run it. Chances of having a problem at the track go up exponentially once you start changing things. The best and more enjoyable track events for me have been with 100% stock cars. You aren't going out there to set FTD or a new track record, you are out there to learn the car and enjoy being out on track. The Fiesta ST is very capable right out of the box, in fact, it is far more capable than 90% of the people driving them. My brother and I ran the Fiesta Movement car very hard, way harder than I would run my own cars, and we never had a single issue. A number of others in the program ran at Sebring and Horse Thief Mile without any problems. Those were 100% stock cars and being ran very hard. Leave the car stock and focus on learning and managing the car on track.

That is good advice for folks who really are not going to do this with high frequency. Get a feel for your car and then determine if it is worth it to make track-specific adjustments.

However, [MENTION=1313]BRGT350[/MENTION]: Take a look at the [MENTION=2925]Rhinopolis[/MENTION] signature. Heh. His car is *already* not stock.

Indeed...it is FAR from stock. My car is closer to stock. LOL.

 

[BRGT350]

ha, yeah, the car isn't very stock to begin with. The OP was talking about a stock ST.

You are 100% right that getting a feel for the car and how much you plan to track it makes a difference. Some track as much as they can, and others, like me, get out to the track every few years. I miss the days when it was as much as possible, but life gets in the way sometimes.

 

[commonplatypus]

Coming up on my first track night since Octane Academy this Sunday. Very excited. Just flushed the brake fluid and put some ATE Type 200 in for good measure. I definitely boiled the fluid at some point because I had air in the lines. This was likely during an autocross event some time back where I had someone co driving the car with me. I was going to swap the pads out, but at only 14k miles; I think they will be okay and I am not exactly pro enough to probably ruin them. I'll check them afterwards and see hwo they held up, but I don't really expect problems. If they go sour, I'll just replace them with a set of EBC Yellowstuff, I think.

 

[Siestarider]

Stock is great. Engine much more likely to pull power due to high charge air temps than coolant/oil temps. If your power is pulled on track, just cool down and run next session with heater on and less full throttle, run easier laps.

A better IC is necessary if you like tracking and do more of it.

Biggest danger stock is becoming overconfident on track with ESC on; then realize its cooking your brakes; then turn it off and drive the same way as with it on.

I did all the above and spun. ESC is so good it conceals small errors and corrects big ones.

 

[commonplatypus]

Stock is great. Engine much more likely to pull power due to high charge air temps than coolant/oil temps. If your power is pulled on track, just cool down and run next session with heater on and less full throttle, run easier laps.

A better IC is necessary if you like tracking and do more of it.

Biggest danger stock is becoming overconfident on track with ESC on; then realize its cooking your brakes; then turn it off and drive the same way as with it on.

I did all the above and spun. ESC is so good it conceals small errors and corrects big ones.

Thanks for all the great info! Can never have enough prep talk.

I've had a better fmic before when I was tuned and I'm familiar with the difference made. I think i'll be okay for my first few track days and I'll probably run ESC off as I have a good feel for how the car behaves thanks to autocross and a set of super sticky RE71R tires.

 

[BostonDriver]

The best thing you can do to save your brakes besides upgrading the fluid, pads, lines, etc. is turn off the electronic stability control. Not just sport mode, turn it off completely.

 

[GypsyBagelhands]

Hey guys, Thank you SO MUCH for all of the great advice. I'll probably just be doing water/water wetter and going from there. I guess I'll expect the car to start pulling timing as it gets hotter but I should have some time between runs and can let it cool off a bit. I'll be sure to turn off the ESC and see how the brakes do. Apparently the track isn't too hard on brakes so it'll be interesting to see if the little baby brakes the car comes with can handle the heat!

 

[Siestarider]

I read an interesting POV in a recent issue of R/T, by an instructor who will not instruct a noob pupil who wants to run with ESC off. It is definitely safer with it on in modern cars.

From driver POV, I believe it depends on what your goal is. If just to have fun, go fast right now, and be safe, leave it on. Brake pads are cheap.

If you want to develop the skills necessary for eventually driving on track as quickly as the car will allow, and are willing to put the seat time in, turn it off as soon as possible. Take it easier at beginning and work your way safely up to your first spin.