Typical dealer tactics?

[dsphil]

So I ordered a magnetic with recaro from a dealer Wednesday and they said will have it on Friday. I following up that morning and the sales told me will arrive late afternoon 4-5. An hour later I received a call telling me it will arrive Monday and ask me to go there sign the papers. I kindly refuse that I will do the papers when the car arrived. He started to get pushy saying that it's the same car I ordered and I agreed on the price. Please note that Friday was the last day of the month June. I insisted to wait until Monday until the car arrived and he told me I may not have the 0% by then. So I tell him to forget it. He then said talk to manager will honor the agreed price.
The reason he said because they can't find driver to deliver the car from a different dealer. Anyways, does anyone know if the car will be driven to the dealer or transport by a transporter? What normal miles should a new car have on delivery? I am concern that it might be driven to the dealer and who know what the driver habits are.

 

[MKVIIST]

I had mine flatbed from another dealer, but it really all depends on the dealer and how far they are from each other. I would say as long as it's 100 miles or less I would be okay.

I will agree that its never a good idea to sign anything until you get a chance to inspect and test drive the car. There might be some flaws here and there that you may not be happy with and can negotiate that into the price.

So I ordered a magnetic with recaro from a dealer Wednesday and they said will have it on Friday. I following up that morning and the sales told me will arrive late afternoon 4-5. An hour later I received a call telling me it will arrive Monday and ask me to go there sign the papers. I kindly refuse that I will do the papers when the car arrived. He started to get pushy saying that it's the same car I ordered and I agreed on the price. Please note that Friday was the last day of the month June. I insisted to wait until Monday until the car arrived and he told me I may not have the 0% by then. So I tell him to forget it. He then said talk to manager will honor the agreed price.
The reason he said because they can't find driver to deliver the car from a different dealer. Anyways, does anyone know if the car will be driven to the dealer or transport by a transporter? What normal miles should a new car have on delivery? I am concern that it might be driven to the dealer and who know what the driver habits are.

 

[M-Sport fan]

The reason he said because they can't find driver to deliver the car from a different dealer. Anyways, does anyone know if the car will be driven to the dealer or transport by a transporter? What normal miles should a new car have on delivery? I am concern that it might be driven to the dealer and who know what the driver habits are.

^^^EXACTLY WHY I ordered mine, and waited/suffered for 4 months without a car.

My dealer INSISTED on one of their salespeople/drivers fetching one from ~100 miles away, and REFUSED to flatbed it here unless I paid about $250.00 extra, and they also refused to let me ride along to pick up that car.
I so totally did not trust their drivers, and the damage that they could inflict in those miles (and which may not even show up until AFTER the warranties are gone), I said FORGET IT, and ordered one, even though they did everything in their power to try and keep me from doing so.

I now regret not renting a car, and driving down to Baltimore for the deals at Koons Ford there (I later found out they had 8 on their lot, EXACTLY how I ordered mine, for almost $3500.00 LESS than I paid at Fred Beans in Doylestown! ).

Which dealer did you go to in our area?
Was it a Fred Beans owned store?

 

[dsphil]

The dealers of the ghettos. It was McCafferty Ford in Langhorne. I check their inventory today and it was in stock. Now they're closed, I can't go there to check on it. I didn't received a call from sales. So I think they either try to sell it since it might be a busy weekend or screwing with me. In the meantime I have put a hold on my deposit check just in case. I don't have a good feeling about this. They probably will give me a different price by then. Like you mentioned, I might take to trip to Koons, but I heard that Maryland do impose another freight cost in addition to designation and delivery to the window sticker MSRP.

^^^EXACTLY WHY I ordered mine, and waited/suffered for 4 months without a car.

My dealer INSISTED on one of their salespeople/drivers fetching one from ~100 miles away, and REFUSED to flatbed it here unless I paid about $250.00 extra, and they also refused to let me ride along to pick up that car.
I so totally did not trust their drivers, and the damage that they could inflict in those miles (and which may not even show up until AFTER the warranties are gone), I said FORGET IT, and ordered one, even though they did everything in their power to try and keep me from doing so.

I now regret not renting a car, and driving down to Baltimore for the deals at Koons Ford there (I later found out they had 8 on their lot, EXACTLY how I ordered mine, for almost $3500.00 LESS than I paid at Fred Beans in Doylestown! ).

Which dealer did you go to in our area?
Was it a Fred Beans owned store?

 

[M-Sport fan]

^^^I test drove a FiST there for the first time in March 2016.

They ARE now owned by Fred Beans, so I am NOT surprised in the least at how poorly they have treated you.
Their stealerships seem to have the attitude that, "we are the ONLY game in town, so we can eff you over if we want and get away with it every time".
Almost as if they are daring you to go buy somewhere else, GREAT 'business model' there.

 

[jmrtsus]

Watch out for Koons.......great ad prices but when it came down to the sales invoice it was nowhere near the ad price! No better than I got locally. I asked for an invoice to take to the bank and pick up a check. They invoice they sent almost $4k higher than the ad price. Said ad price included all possible rebates in the world knowing you can't get them all and a "trade discount" I did not get because I did not trade my car. Seem to remember some high dealer's fees also. Just make damn sure you have a signed sales invoice before traveling there or anywhere else for that matter.

 

[Blown]

So I ordered a magnetic with recaro from a dealer Wednesday and they said will have it on Friday. I following up that morning and the sales told me will arrive late afternoon 4-5. An hour later I received a call telling me it will arrive Monday and ask me to go there sign the papers. I kindly refuse that I will do the papers when the car arrived. He started to get pushy saying that it's the same car I ordered and I agreed on the price. Please note that Friday was the last day of the month June. I insisted to wait until Monday until the car arrived and he told me I may not have the 0% by then. So I tell him to forget it. He then said talk to manager will honor the agreed price.
The reason he said because they can't find driver to deliver the car from a different dealer. Anyways, does anyone know if the car will be driven to the dealer or transport by a transporter? What normal miles should a new car have on delivery? I am concern that it might be driven to the dealer and who know what the driver habits are.

5-200 miles is normal, but we'll have cars in stock that were driven from a few states away that have 500 or so miles.

They weren't playing games in terms of trying to get the deal done before the end of the month, just trying to hit their number from Ford or maybe the salesman needed one more car for bonus. Rebates and incentivized rates don't carry from month to month either.

I've ran into problems with people trying to factory order a car with current rebates and expecting them to remain the same months later when the car arrives. And I can't contract on the factory order car to take advantage of current rebates until it's had a VIN assigned either.

 

[richtor]

1. When you special order a new vehicle, the dealer will put your exact car/options to the manufacturer and they will build it for you. Takes generally 6-12 weeks depending on their build cycle. With Ford it will have Special Order on the Sticker. Link to Special Order Raptor Sticker:
http://www.windowsticker.forddirect...BvrSSfDV1l7Q7oZa+gZpuKjlS8SCtxKRzOkbB2wcskYs=

2. When you special order, you will pay the pricing and get the incentives available when you receive the vehicle, not when you order it.
I like to get in writing a certain amount below msrp or invoice in writing plus incentives when vehicle arrives when I order.
You are also allowed to walk away from the order. Which is why most dealers charge a non refundable deposit for the order.

3. What the dealer in the OP's case did is dealer locate in order to dealer trade.
You get the car faster.
It may not have the exact options you wanted.
It may have test miles on it by people who never wanted and dont care for the car.

This is much different than a special order.

4. Dealer trade will have miles driven in the car from test drives. These miles will generally be much worse than miles put on to actually drive the car to the selling dealership.
You should get a better deal because the car has been test driven.
Anything over 100 miles in test drives is way too much. This does not include dealer trade miles.

5. You can have the dealer flat bed deliver dealer trades. This expense will be paid by the purchaser.

 

[M-Sport fan]

5-200 miles is normal, but we'll have cars in stock that were driven from a few states away that have 500 or so miles.

They weren't playing games in terms of trying to get the deal done before the end of the month, just trying to hit their number from Ford or maybe the salesman needed one more car for bonus. Rebates and incentivized rates don't carry from month to month either.

I've ran into problems with people trying to factory order a car with current rebates and expecting them to remain the same months later when the car arrives. And I can't contract on the factory order car to take advantage of current rebates until it's had a VIN assigned either.

Since it appears that you work in a dealership's sales department, maybe you can answer this (since mine would NOT);

Is there some kind of insurance/liability infringement, (or rule/law against) the customer riding along as a passenger on the way to, AND in their potential/future car, on the way BACK from the 'trade' dealership??

 

[dsphil]

Interesting. Since my case is a dealer trade, if they can not get the car in their lot before the incentives expired, can they change the negotiated priced? If I walk away, will they refund my deposit? My concern was they can wait until the incentive expires then contact me since they failed to close me at the end of the month maybe..

1. When you special order a new vehicle, the dealer will put your exact car/options to the manufacturer and they will build it for you. Takes generally 6-12 weeks depending on their build cycle. With Ford it will have Special Order on the Sticker. Link to Special Order Raptor Sticker:
http://www.windowsticker.forddirect...BvrSSfDV1l7Q7oZa+gZpuKjlS8SCtxKRzOkbB2wcskYs=

2. When you special order, you will pay the pricing and get the incentives available when you receive the vehicle, not when you order it.
I like to get in writing a certain amount below msrp or invoice in writing plus incentives when vehicle arrives when I order.
You are also allowed to walk away from the order. Which is why most dealers charge a non refundable deposit for the order.

3. What the dealer in the OP's case did is dealer locate in order to dealer trade.
You get the car faster.
It may not have the exact options you wanted.
It may have test miles on it by people who never wanted and dont care for the car.

This is much different than a special order.

4. Dealer trade will have miles driven in the car from test drives. These miles will generally be much worse than miles put on to actually drive the car to the selling dealership.
You should get a better deal because the car has been test driven.
Anything over 100 miles in test drives is way too much. This does not include dealer trade miles.

5. You can have the dealer flat bed deliver dealer trades. This expense will be paid by the purchaser.

 

[richtor]

Yes, it's a liability. If there's a car wreck and you're not an employee of the dealer they are libel for your welfare regardless if the accident is the fault of their employee or not.

If you want to ride, negotiate straight through the dealer that has your actual car and drive their and back yourself in your new car.

Dealer trades are always a risk for the dealer. If driving back they get a rock chip in the windshield or if someone cuts them off causing an accident. The dealer has to fix the vehicle on their dime and now the value of the vehicle has just diminished. They now have a car they don't want nor can they sell it for what they paid for it.

 

[dsphil]

^^Thanks for the enlightenment.

Now you have me became very curious.. Beside reason sales try to meet quota is that the vehicle have damages and ask me to sign the papers before showing me the car, then I will lost all my negotiate power and can not walk away. Their website inventory status showed the car was in stock Saturday. Felt a little bummed out.

 

[richtor]

Interesting. Since my case is a dealer trade, if they can not get the car in their lot before the incentives expired, can they change the negotiated priced? If I walk away, will they refund my deposit? My concern was they can wait until the incentive expires then contact me since they failed to close me at the end of the month maybe..

Negotiated price and incentives are two separate items. The dealer has control over pricing. They can sell it for more or less than they paid the dealer for it. Incentives are set by the manufacturer and the vehicle needs to be purchased within the dates of the incentives to recieve them.

If your negotiated price was 2k under msrp including a 1k rebate: after the expiration of the rebate your new negotiated price will be 1k below msrp. However after expiration you can go back to the renegotiate the entire deal.

The dealer pays invoice for the vehicle. They do not pay for the vehicle in cash and get a loan through the bank. This means every month a vehicle is sitting it's costing them money in interest paid.
They also get money back from the manufacturer when the vehicle is sold. This is called the holdback. The ST holdback is $755 I believe.
The dealer will also get dealer cash. This number is not given to the public. I think it's incentives given to the public and more. 1k rebate, the dealer cash may be 1600.

The older the vehicle the more money Ford will give in incentives to move the vehicle. The older(more days on lot) the vehicle the more money the vehicle costs the dealership.

Hope this helps.


I was looking a month ago. I conacted a dealer and said I would buy one of their 2 2016 ST at 4k below msrp and 0% financing offered from Ford. They told 2k was as low as they can go. I found a dealer to meet my price and I saw one of their cars on the road. The owner said he got 4k back of msrp which is exactly what I had offered a month before. Haha

 

[Blown]

Since it appears that you work in a dealership's sales department, maybe you can answer this (since mine would NOT);

Is there some kind of insurance/liability infringement, (or rule/law against) the customer riding along as a passenger on the way to, AND in their potential/future car, on the way BACK from the 'trade' dealership??

Eh insurance could be an excuse but on the same token most dealerships offer shuttle rides to customers so it would be the same concept. At my dealership I've never encountered a customer who wanted to ride on a DX run but I'd go with it may just be company policy

Interesting. Since my case is a dealer trade, if they can not get the car in their lot before the incentives expired, can they change the negotiated priced? If I walk away, will they refund my deposit? My concern was they can wait until the incentive expires then contact me since they failed to close me at the end of the month maybe..

It would be kind of dirty but if you didn't sign any legally binding contract then yeah. I don't know what the current incentives on ford products but I'm sure even if the rebates went away they'd have dealer cash/coupons they'd apply that you wouldn't see to get to the same price. They can't legally keep your deposit either

 

[richtor]

^^Thanks for the enlightenment.

Now you have me became very curious.. Beside reason sales try to meet quota is that the vehicle have damages and ask me to sign the papers before showing me the car, then I will lost all my negotiate power and can not walk away. Their website inventory status showed the car was in stock Saturday. Felt a little dummed.

I'm not sure how they can sell a car they don't have as they need to put actual mileage on the car at time of sale. You could walk away even after papers signed if the car does not match the paperwork. Anything else one would need legal help to back out. Most dealers won't do this as it is bad practice.

As far as stock it may say in inventory even though it may be at another dealer that is owned by the same company. This happens all the time for used cars.

 

[richtor]

Eh insurance could be an excuse but on the same token most dealerships offer shuttle rides to customers so it would be the same concept. At my dealership I've never encountered a customer who wanted to ride on a DX run but I'd go with it may just be company policy




It would be kind of dirty but if you didn't sign any legally binding contract then yeah. I don't know what the current incentives on ford products but I'm sure even if the rebates went away they'd have dealer cash/coupons they'd apply that you wouldn't see to get to the same price. They can't legally keep your deposit either

They can't keep your deposit? If I order options only I would want then back out. That would give the dealer a vehicle they can't sell. Which is the reason for the deposit.

 

[Blown]

The deposit is 100% refundable. Most people assume a deposit isn't and dealerships would rather them think that way but we can't keep it if you haven't signed anything that explicitly says it's non refundable.

I have no problems taking a deposit on a car until a customer can come check it out. If they like it cool, I'll refund it to their card or use the money as a down payment, whatever they want. If they don't like it it is what it is, still getting their money back p

If it's a factory order car that's a common config I'll just run a card for however much and refund it if the car isn't what they want when it comes in. There's no way to order a purple car with pink interior just because that's what someone wants so being stuck with a car isn't something to worry about

 

[dsphil]

So the possibility is towards that the car might have damages. It is not the same company. The car is from Maryland. Dealers list inventory in their websites either in-stock, dealer ordered, or extended inventory which I don't know what this means.

Oh well, I just have to carefully inspect it and pay attention to the test drive.

I'm not sure how they can sell a car they don't have as they need to put actual mileage on the car at time of sale. You could walk away even after papers signed if the car does not match the paperwork. Anything else one would need legal help to back out. Most dealers won't do this as it is bad practice.

As far as stock it may say in inventory even though it may be at another dealer that is owned by the same company. This happens all the time for used cars.

 

[richtor]

Unless it's an Aston Martin or Ferrari.

 

[Blown]

So the possibility is towards that the car might have damages. It is not the same company. The car is from Maryland. Dealers list inventory in their websites either in-stock, dealer ordered, or extended inventory which I don't know what this means.

Oh well, I just have to carefully inspect it and pay attention to the test drive.

Extended inventory means it's at a sister store