Michelin Pilot Sport 3 after 1000 miles

[velryb]

Hello, I would like to share my bed experince with those tires. I used them only for 1500 km (about 1000 miles). They have better grip than potenzas and I heard a lot of good experience with them. Some friends have them still and no problem. Up to now I used stock potenzas 205/40/17 and adhesion is not so good I need. For example rear pair died after one circuit experience (but before it there were on front wheels and they tolerate stress in 4 slalom tracks without big problems - it is normal, that every slalom means 1,5 mm of tread down, but no problem with side walls). So after this circuit experience I bought 4 Pilot S3. I gave Potenza from front wheels to rear wheels and new Pilots to front wheels. 1000 miles on roads and than one slalom. Only one...and this is result of it. Holes in sidewalls. :-( Tread stayed at about 7 mm! As you can see, there are no writing, there went totaly down. After maybe 15 minutes on the slalom tracks. There were 30 other cars and nobody had this problem. The surface was very nice - flat and soft. But the sidewalls are really incredibly weak. :-( Maybe only very bed series, but I can´t trust them after this experience.....

And in this photo you can see, how much was sidewalls bending. Too much. :-( I can´t recommend this tires....:-( Pressure was normal, about 2,3-2,4 atm (for slalom is normal give even less!)

 

[CanadianGuy]

Wow, you are lucky the tire did not detach from the rim.

 

[shouldbeasy]

Wow, you are lucky the tire did not detach from the rim.

It sure looks like it was trying to!! Isn't each of the half-moon circles a cut out from the wheel when the sidewall compressed to flat? Almost like a pinch flat on a mountain bike.

 

[GAbOS]

Any idea what PSI/KPI they were at?

 

[CanadianGuy]

Any idea what PSI/KPI they were at?

2.4atm is about 35psi.

 

[velryb]

Yes, it is real value, I messured it after action (and before too, for slalom it is very important information).

 

[GAbOS]

2.4atm is about 35psi.

thanks!! I need more coffee. I skimmed the thread another time before I posted to make sure he didn't already mention it.

 

[GAbOS]

Yes, it is real value, I messured it after action (and before too, for slalom it is very important information).

Were they 2.4atm after the run or before? That seems like a low number with lots of heat in them.

 

[velryb]

The value before race was about 2,6 atm, so I reduced the pressure to 2,1 atm. Value about 2 atm is good for start, if you don´t know new tires and their behaviour on the track. And it was quite ok, good grip (for example for potenzas on front wheels I need only 1,8 atm for adequate grip), so I continue with this pressure. After action is, of course, pressure higher, 2,3 or 2,4 is ok. It is really complicated, it is one of the most important thing, and it is different in different typ of weather, surface, etc. It is necessery to observe car reactions, strengh of skids etc...
And I´m not he. I´m she.

 

[GAbOS]

Yes, tire pressures are very important and can be used to modify balance of the car even. I have never used AS-3's or Michelins on track so I tried to do some googling to find autox use but not much out there. I did find a post where a guy was starting at 2.8atm and posted pictures that looked like he was still rolling over on the tire but not as bad as yours. Most of the tires I've had experience with I started at the 2.4atm range and they would raise to the 3.0atm range.

Either way, those tires are shot after a single run. Either it's a bad run of tires or the tires themselves are not that great or require more pressure.

 

[velryb]

Thank you for you comment. It was really short attempt with this tires. More pressure means more skids and worst time on track. Nothing for me. Next season I want to try yokohama advan neova. I hope, that it will be better. Much better.

 

[Young L]

check out dunlop direzza zII also

 

[Etyrnus]

If they're the Pilot Sport AS/3s, they're all seasons with a 500 treadwear rating. I have them on mine, and I'm at about 50% tread after 20k miles. For daily driving they're just a little less grippy than the stockers, at least to the extent I push the car. But knowing how they can break loose, they would not be a recommended tire for me on an auto-x. And if the sidewalls are doing that, pressures are low and tire is not stiff enough on the sidewall.

 

[velryb]

There were two other cars with same tires and similar pressure and no problem. All my friends can´t believe what happened with tires. I think, that was production mistake. But I don´t want to try them again.

 

[Dustys318]

If the suspension is completely stock go up to 42psi up front and 39psi at the rear. It's the pressures I use and it's given me even wear across the tread (I used a rubber paint line across tread from outside rim to inside rim to see how far up the paint scrubs to check sidewall stability). Paint was worn off only on tread at those tire pressures...

 

[Siestarider]

I second Dusty's recommendation, with those pressures (dropped 1 lb in 90 degrees and above) my BFG Comp-2's have worn remarkably well on track, 7 days this year and more coming up. Plus about 10K on street, still have even tread. Not the fastest tire, but good for learning.

 

[RAAMaudio]

From looking at the the picture the pressure was way to low for your particular car, geometry, weight, FWD and they are not really designed for autocross(slolom). You cannot go by other tires or other cars pressures, one run and you should of looked them over and better yet checked the heat across the tread, outside, middle and inside should all be very close in temps.

For Solom an infrared gauge works great as the heat is not that deep into the tire or as I have become used to, the palm of my hand.

Also bring a water sprayer if getting to hot to cool them down between runs, move the car a couple of times to get to all the tread and if the brakes get quite hot a good thing to do as well.

Add more negative front camber, it will help a great deal.

Sorry they were ruined so soon as very costly to buy

 

[velryb]

Thank you very much for interesting information. I thought about more negative front camber, but I am not sure if it is good idea. My fiesta is mainly family car (second car) and not only race car. Racing is only perfect fun for me. But primary I need really safe car, because my husband use her (for me it is person not only thing ) too and he is handicapped. So no really race brakes, tires and other setting out of stock, that could have influence to handling. He has already now big respect of her. ) So I have to find good compromise between ordinary using and my desire to be faster and faster on tracks.
For next season I plan to buy extra set of race wheels and tires only for slalom (and new brakes, EBC maybe, because stock brakes have quite problem with cooling and not always it is possible to go to country road to cool the brakes, often is slalom in closed area, only parking and track) and we will see it will be enough (I want to attend only categorie for serial cars).
And other aspect of more negative front camber (and if I know, it is not possible to set it in stock chassis), of course - the tread goes down quickly....and I drive every year more than 20000 km (with fiesta, other 30000 km with S-Max), so it is maybe one extra set of tires.