HELP! Frozen front brake calipers!!

[Booster]

So I dropped my car off yesterday to a well regarded nearby mechanic to replace the front pads and rotors. I went with centric cryogenic blanks and mountune street pads. Being that the car is modified and I wasn't using OEM parts I didn't want to use the dealership. Also I have done 90% of the mods on my car but brakes I wanted to leave to a "Pro". Well 4 hours later I talk with the mechanic and he says the front calipers are stuck.

He had put the replacement parts on, swapped back to the stock parts, bled the brake system 3 times, but nothing would fix the problem. He knew about the pads being outside and inside specific. The front brakes won't retract, making the car not drivable. When we turn on the car the screen says "Hill start assist not available". That is the only clue. No ABS lights or any warning lights on the dash. So maybe the HSA is engaging for some weird reason??!! My only idea is to disconnect the battery and see if that resets something. If he can't fix it I will flash the car back to stock and get it towed to the dealership. I am not about to flatspot my brand new Indy 500's driving it with locked brakes. Ughh, what a nightmare. Any help or tips are welcome. Thanks guys.

 

[cxwrench]

Seems like a simple fix to me. Remove the calipers and either clean/grease the pins the caliper slides on or replace them. Or is it the pistons that are now stuck? A good mechanic should have no problem figuring this out.

 

[Questionable]

Check to make sure the brake *pedal* is depressing the switches fully when your foot is off it. Try pulling the pedal up towards the seat and see if the brakes free up.

Sent from my H8314 using Tapatalk

 

[maestromaestro]

So I dropped my car off yesterday to a well regarded nearby mechanic to replace the front pads and rotors. I went with centric cryogenic blanks and mountune street pads. Being that the car is modified and I wasn't using OEM parts I didn't want to use the dealership. Also I have done 90% of the mods on my car but brakes I wanted to leave to a "Pro". Well 4 hours later I talk with the mechanic and he says the front calipers are stuck.

He had put the replacement parts on, swapped back to the stock parts, bled the brake system 3 times, but nothing would fix the problem. He knew about the pads being outside and inside specific. The front brakes won't retract, making the car not drivable. When we turn on the car the screen says "Hill start assist not available". That is the only clue. No ABS lights or any warning lights on the dash. So maybe the HSA is engaging for some weird reason??!! My only idea is to disconnect the battery and see if that resets something. If he can't fix it I will flash the car back to stock and get it towed to the dealership. I am not about to flatspot my brand new Indy 500's driving it with locked brakes. Ughh, what a nightmare. Any help or tips are welcome. Thanks guys.

Your mechanic needs to go through this systematically. Determine if the pistons are stuck or if the pins are stuck, or if the brake pedal is not returning to original position. All of it can be checked with calipers off the rotors.

What makes it strange though is that BOTH of the front calipers show this behavior?

Do our cars have brake proportioning valve??

 

[Questionable]

Your mechanic needs to go through this systematically. Determine if the pistons are stuck or if the pins are stuck, or if the brake pedal is not returning to original position. All of it can be checked with calipers off the rotors.

What makes it strange though is that BOTH of the front calipers show this behavior?

Do our cars have brake proportioning valve??

The ABS block does the brake proportioning, along with the traction control, stability control, and the torque vectoring.

I have had issues that sound like this several times after brake bleeding, especially if the brakes are bled with the traditional two-person pump-the-pedal way. And every time I have dragging brakes I've found that the brake pedal has bent and doesn't fully engage both switches when I'm not touching the brake pedal. It's annoying, but I keep a set of big pliers with my whenever I do brake work now.

Sent from my H8314 using Tapatalk

 

[kivnul]

If it is both sides it could be the ABS, Master cylinder or brake pedal. It is statistically unfeasible that both calipers or both pins suddenly seized on their own. I have heard that if the mechanic pushes in the pistons without the bleeder open it forces the fluid backwards thru the ABS and can cause problems. When the mechanic is attempting to bleed the brakes afterwards, is fluid coming out? I know its not normal, but maybe try to bleed the brakes with the engine running (using 2 person pedal depress method), it may reset the hardware in the ABS.

 

[Booster]

The ABS block does the brake proportioning, along with the traction control, stability control, and the torque vectoring.

I have had issues that sound like this several times after brake bleeding, especially if the brakes are bled with the traditional two-person pump-the-pedal way. And every time I have dragging brakes I've found that the brake pedal has bent and doesn't fully engage both switches when I'm not touching the brake pedal. It's annoying, but I keep a set of big pliers with my whenever I do brake work now.

Sent from my H8314 using Tapatalk

Okay this is a huge relief to know that at least someone has dealt with something similar. This sounds like it is probably the problem especially since I know he bled the brakes multiple times. The way they were locked it did seem like the switch was telling them to do so. Thank you sir! Let’s hope this does the trick.

 

[Questionable]

Let us know what fixes the issue! You're not the first person to ask about this sort of problem.

Sent from my H8314 using Tapatalk

 

[Booster]

So I got an update from my mechanic. He was able to get help from an off duty Ford tech. They looked at the pedal and made sure it was engaging the switches. There were never any codes and no issue with the abs. They narrowed it down to the driver side caliper sensor and determined it was bad. They got a new sensor from Ford, swapped it in and finally the caliper moved freely and returned to the correct position. Once they had that done he went ahead and put in the new rotors and pads.

Now I’m holding my breath to see what the bill will be because I know he wants to charge me more than the standard time. I’m thinking he must have done something wrong or out of order that damaged that sensor during the job. It was fine when I dropped it off. I know I’ll be on the hook for the new part, but if he tries to add a bunch of diagnostic and labor time that is not going to fly with me.

We shall see. Stay tuned.

 

[Ford ST]

What sensor there are no sensors in the caliper? .

Sent from my LG-LS997 using Tapatalk

 

[Questionable]

What sensor there are no sensors in the caliper? .

Sent from my LG-LS997 using Tapatalk

I'm going to guess the ABS sensor. I have replace mine before.

Sent from my H8314 using Tapatalk

 

[Dpro]

I'm going to guess the ABS sensor. I have replace mine before.

Sent from my H8314 using Tapatalk

That would be the only one there is. I smell a fail Yelp review for this mechanic.

 

[maestromaestro]

You know, replacing pads and rotors is one of the simplest jobs on this car. Also, since you didn't modify the brakes, the dealership wouldn't likely have given you any guff about the job, either. Just my $.02

 

[maestromaestro]

I'm going to guess the ABS sensor. I have replace mine before.

Sent from my H8314 using Tapatalk

ABS sensor is not in the caliper, not even close. So, what was this mechanic talking about? The Johnson rod?

 

[Booster]

It was the brake light switch that connects to the pedal that went bad. This switch also controls the hill start assist hence the message on the driver info center. It was not the abs sensor or anything near the caliper, I misunderstood that over the phone. After he changed the part it continued to give him grief because the brake light was staying on when the pedal was up. It needed careful adjustment to get the sweet spot and not go too far and be back to square one (as he described it)

Best guess is that the teeth on the plunger inside the switch were damaged during the bleeding process.

In the end he just said what do yuh think is fair? I paid him $100 for the original job agreement, $25 for the switch, and $50 to cover the helper he hired. I might have paid more and I do feel bad he had to spend so much time on it, but at the end of the day I feel it could have been avoided if he had done some research ahead of time or been more careful during the job. Just glad it’s over. Did a brief test drive and the car seems fine.

 

[Booster]

https://www.amazon.com/Motorcraft-S...ocphy=1013819&hvtargid=pla-571344364975&psc=1

 

[Dpro]

HMmm looks like someone really romped on your brake pedal during the bleeding process. I would say once again Yelp fail review for that shop.

 

[D1JL]

It is funny.
Even if you take your car into a professional shop there is no law requiring that the employees know what they are doing (in California) or even it they have ever done a brake job before.
There is no law that requires you to even own any tools to open a repair shop.

 

[Questionable]

It was the brake light switch that connects to the pedal that went bad. This switch also controls the hill start assist hence the message on the driver info center. It was not the abs sensor or anything near the caliper, I misunderstood that over the phone. After he changed the part it continued to give him grief because the brake light was staying on when the pedal was up. It needed careful adjustment to get the sweet spot and not go too far and be back to square one (as he described it)

Best guess is that the teeth on the plunger inside the switch were damaged during the bleeding process.

In the end he just said what do yuh think is fair? I paid him $100 for the original job agreement, $25 for the switch, and $50 to cover the helper he hired. I might have paid more and I do feel bad he had to spend so much time on it, but at the end of the day I feel it could have been avoided if he had done some research ahead of time or been more careful during the job. Just glad it’s over. Did a brief test drive and the car seems fine.
View attachment 22347 View attachment 22348

Oh sweet. I have also replace those switches, but I didn't take them apart so it's cool to see where yours failed.

I don't think that this is entirely the mechanic's fault. I don't know if it takes too much force on the pedal to bleed the brakes or if that switch is just junk or a bit of both, but I have had to replace that switch for locked brakes AND again to fix pedal feel (detailed here) after 2-3 years of heavy track use. Using a vacuum/pressure bleeder might have avoided the issue, but those seem to be hit or miss at the shops I work with.

 

[DieselMech]

If they worked perfectly fine before you went in, then all of a sudden something fails related to what they are working on I’d be suspect as fuck. I would also think as a shop they wouldn’t be using a two person brake bleed procedure.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk