Brake pad options for track - Stock OK?

[Moonchopper]

I interpreted from another thread that the stock 2014 FiST pads might be okay for track usage - Does anyone know whether or not this is the case? I have an HPDE coming up at VIR end of February, and I just bought my FiST. I'm trying to determine what I need to do in order to make it trackable. This will be my 3rd track session, and I tend to go a bit hard - Previously, I had a 2010 Camaro SS with 421 RWHP that I was running DTC70s up front and DTC60s in the rear, and I'm fairly certain I was overheating them (potentially due to poor cooling - Or I don't know what I"m talking about )

Should I still look at getting a set of rotors/pads to dedicate to track, or will the stock pads hold up fine? I autocross as well, but I'm fairly certain the stock pads will work just fine (they seem to be pretty aggressive, anyways).

 

[Brick]

Here's my opinion.

Are you okay with POTENTIALLY throwing in a couple of cool down laps in the middle of a session? Are you okay with POTENTIALLY going through your stock pads quickly?
If yes, then try out the stock pads and see how it goes.

Is VIR tough on brakes?

I put some DTC-60's up front and stock pads in the rear for my hpdes and im really happy with the set up.
I think the most important thing would be to bleed the brakes with some quality fluid and maybe take off the dust cover/dirt guards that surround the rotors.

 

[Moonchopper]

VIR has 2 high speed straights on full course, and I haven't driven Grand yet (which will be run this time) which has the same straights - I was getting up to about 142 mph on the back straight, and 135 on the front in my Camaro, so I think it's very hard on brakes. Also, considering the potential overheating issues of the stock Fiestas, I might have to throw in some cool down laps regardless (which I'm perfectly fine with).

I will also be putting RBF600 for my brake fluid (since I will need to change it anyways - club requires it to be changed at least 90 days prior to track day), so should be no problems there.

In any case, it sounds like I might be better off going ahead and getting some different pads - Checking Hawk's website, I don't see an option for Fiesta STs - only S and SEs. Is the fitment the same between S/SE/ST? The part number for the DTC-60s I found are the following: HB668G.567. Any idea if that matches your own FiST DTC-60s?

 

[Chuckable]

At PBIR in Florida with the MP215 tune but otherwise totally stock the OEM pads held up fine, though the pedal was a little soft by the end of the day. Wore through a good amount of pad material, and by the end of the day the system needed bleeding. Depending upon how demanding your local track is, the OEM pads will probably last, but will not be left unscathed. I've also read a few accounts of rear pads wearing very quickly. Probably depends again on the track. Have fun!

Mountune carries upgraded brake pads. May want to check there first.

 

[Siestarider]

Stock pads work fine for me if you turn off ESC completely. If you leave it on rears will go faster. Drive hard in sport mode, you will be amazed how fast front pads wear. Even with it fully off, pulling hard out of turns will use up front pads, torque vectoring cannot be turned off.

I used up a set of new bedded Hawk Street/Race fronts at Sebring in two days with ESC fully off. A set of Autozone guaranteed for life fronts lasted one track day. Last year when OEM pads were not available.

Best front brake management solution available is a LSD. Next is cooling them better, but not much track data available on how that can be done.

 

[carramrod]

Best front brake management solution available is a LSD.

I would argue that the best front brake management solution is your right foot

 

[Siestarider]

Leave your ESC on, never touch brakes, drive the car as fast as you can on track. Car will eat the brakes for you.

 

[carramrod]

Why would you leave ESC on while at the track?

 

[Siestarider]

So you can pretend you are quick.

 

[Moonchopper]

I turned my ESC off on the Camaro when I was at the track after my first HPDE at VIR - I had left it in Competitive mode initially, because I was terrified of driving it so fast for my first HPDE (competitive mode just relaxes the threshold for traction control and ESC, I believe). I was going through the uphill esses at about 95+mph, went over a rumble strip while turning, and felt the right side grab the brakes - freaked myself and my instructor out (who yelled at me because he thought I had tapped the brakes), because it's a notorious spot for upsetting the suspension if you make any adjustments to your steering or acceleration. After that, I turned that shit right off - I'll be doing the same in the Fiesta for sure, just for peace of mind.

I think I'm going to end up getting some Carbotech XP10s and run them against the stock rotors I have right now (since I can replace those later if I need to - there don't appear to be any problems with them currently).

Thanks for the input, all!

 

[mercdank]

I posted this in another thread about upgrading pads.

So I spoke to someone over at Hawk and they concluded that the RS-T pad is most likely the same compound as their new Street/Race pad. He compared the description along with the temperature range to conclude this. He also mentioned that this new Street/Race compound pad is essentially the next generation HP+ pad, which is currently marketed as their "autocross" pad. He said that the new Street/Race compound is the same compound as their track-spec DTC60 pad, but with added shims and something else he said that helps reduce noise and make it a little more street friendly, hence the Street/Race moniker.

He recommended the Street/Race pads up front, and their HP+ pads in the rear.

Front - Hawk Street/Race Pad - HB725R.650
Rear - Hawk HP Plus - HB430N.547

 

[Moonchopper]

According to this document from Hawk, I don't think that setup will work for me. I think that setup might be more suitable for a newer driver, and I tend to go fairly aggressive on the track (though I am by no means an incredibly experienced driver ). I think I would need to improve the brake cooling to be able to use the Street/race Pad and HP+ set up.

Of course, I have yet to track the Fiesta, so perhaps the lower weight will lend itself well to not generating as much heat as the Camaro SS did!

 

[mercdank]

I apologize, I should've mentioned that setup was Hawk's recommendation for autocross and spirited daily driving. I agree you might want something more grabby like their dedicated track pads if you're going to be tracking hard.

 

[Siestarider]

That is the same Hawk part # I used a set of up in 2 days. Actually 1.5 days, blew an IC hose off second day and had to drive home to fix it.

 

[mercdank]

Wow, good to know.

 

[Joszer]

Why would you leave ESC on while at the track?

You don't, unless it is raining. Check out my post from 2014. I melted off my brakes at Thunderhill by leaving sport mode on. The torque vectoring kicked in so much that it super heated the pads and melted them down.

 

[Joszer]

I posted this in another thread about upgrading pads.

So I spoke to someone over at Hawk and they concluded that the RS-T pad is most likely the same compound as their new Street/Race pad. He compared the description along with the temperature range to conclude this. He also mentioned that this new Street/Race compound pad is essentially the next generation HP+ pad, which is currently marketed as their "autocross" pad. He said that the new Street/Race compound is the same compound as their track-spec DTC60 pad, but with added shims and something else he said that helps reduce noise and make it a little more street friendly, hence the Street/Race moniker.

He recommended the Street/Race pads up front, and their HP+ pads in the rear.

Front - Hawk Street/Race Pad - HB725R.650
Rear - Hawk HP Plus - HB430N.547

Those HP+ Pads in the rear will Squeal like crazy on the street, my room mate has them in his FiST I can hear him brake from a mile away.