High Mileage Owners Chime in regarding intake valve deposits.

[ZREXER]

Just curious if anyone has had to de-carbon their intake valves because of carbon buildup.

Lots of You-Tube videos showing carbon buildup on eco-boost engines (not specifically the ST's 1.6L engine).

Advise as well if you are running a catch can, or not.

 

[Zormecteon]

I;m curious as to how many of those carboned engines have been run on only top tier gasoline. .. I ran my 1988 Ford Tempo for over 100,000 miles before the first tune up !? mostly on cheap ARCO gasoline. .. at 125,000 was kinda sluggish so I put in a couple of bottles of TECHRON (the Chevron additive) and it cleared it right up. .. So, if you're concerned about your car,.. use premium grade name brand gas, and at least once a week take it to redline in a couple of gears.. what used to be called an Italian tune-up,.. leave the car in 2nd gear and run at 5000 rpm plus for a couple of minutes.. .. it'll blow the carbon right out. ( do this only after having properly warmed up the engine by driving for at least 15 minutes before hand)

 

[ZREXER]

The issue is that on direct injected like our eco-boost engines is that the fuel is injected directly into the cylinder, not upstream of the intake valves so the cleaning properties of gasoline does not keep the carbon sludge build up off the back side of the valves. So what you are suggesting does not work with direct injected engines.

 

[ZREXER]

Good to see the lack of response on this thread as it means no one has had any carbon issues on their intake valves so I guess I won't bother with a catch can then. Perfect.

 

[TUX15ST]

OR MOST PEOPLE ARE RUNNING A CATCH CAN AND DONT HAVE ISSUES

 

[Capri to ST]

Good idea for a thread. I also hope the lack of responses in this thread means there are few problems with this. There's a long thread (269 Posts) about this stickied higher up in the Maintenance sub-forum with no posts for a while, so it will be good to get some updated info. I read that whole thing as an interested prospective owner, and for those who don't have time or patience to read it all, here is what I got from it and a few others as far as the outlook for our cars and good ways to prevent carbon buildup on intake valves:

* Ford has done a good job with ECU programming to minimize the issue. Along with new-generation injectors, it appears that this will let our engines be less plagued by this issue than some earlier GDI engines, especially the Audis, so that if we do have to do a cleaning, it will hopefully be considerably less frequent. There indications that in general intake valve buildup is less of a problem on newer GDI engines.Software updates from Ford may help if available.
* Top Tier gas is helpful, as mentioned above.
* Use high quality full synthetic oil.
* Warm the car up to full operating temperature as much as possible and drive it that way for a while.
* Run it hard sometimes after it's fully warmed up, the Italian tuneup mentioned above. There was some debate about this one because of the injector setup on a GDI engine, but hell, at least it'll be fun, right?
* Catch Can? There was a big difference of opinion here, with some feeling they help, and some arguing they don't and that there is essentially one already built into the system by virtue of a vent hose going to an air/oil separator I believe.

 

[allpurposeben]

Good idea for a thread. I also hope the lack of responses in this thread means there are few problems with this. There's a long thread (269 Posts) about this stickied higher up in the Maintenance sub-forum with no posts for a while, so it will be good to get some updated info. I read that whole thing as an interested prospective owner, and for those who don't have time or patience to read it all, here is what I got from it as far as the outlook for our cars and good ways to prevent carbon buildup on intake valves:

* Ford has done a good job with ECU programming to minimize the issue. Along with new-generation injectors, it appears that this will let our engines be less plagued by this issue than some earlier GDI engines, especially the Audis, so that if we do have to do a cleaning, it will hopefully be considerably less frequent. There indications that in general intake valve buildup is less of a problem on newer GDI engines.Software updates from Ford may help if available.
* Top Tier gas is helpful, as mentioned above.
* Use high quality full synthetic oil.
* Warm the car up to full operating temperature as much as possible and drive it that way for a while.
* Run it hard sometimes after it's fully warmed up, the Italian tuneup mentioned above. There was some debate about this one because of the injector setup on a GDI engine, but hell, at least it'll be fun, right?
* Catch Can? There was a big difference of opinion here, with some feeling they help, and some arguing they don't and that there is essentially one already built into the system by virtue of a vent hose going to an air/oil separator I believe.

Can you elaborate on or point to a thread that elaborates on your last point of an inbuilt method of oil separation?

 

[Capri to ST]

Can you elaborate on or point to a thread that elaborates on your last point of an inbuilt method of oil separation?

Yes, these threads-

http://www.fiestastforum.com/forum/threads/8333-How-many-mile-before-occ
Post 10
http://www.fiestastforum.com/forum/threads/5688-Oil-Catch-Can-Comparo?p=172521#post172521
Post 222
http://www.fiestastforum.com/forum/threads/610-Oil-catch-can-Separator/page6
Post # 58

 

[M-Sport fan]

The issue is that on direct injected like our eco-boost engines is that the fuel is injected directly into the cylinder, not upstream of the intake valves so the cleaning properties of gasoline does not keep the carbon sludge build up off the back side of the valves. So what you are suggesting does not work with direct injected engines.

THIS!^^^

But, even though the top tier fuel, and any GOOD, high PEA content additives (Red Line SI-1, Techron Complete, etc.) will never hurt, the only thing suggested above which will (or so I'm told) is the at least occasional (IF not EVERY time the car is driven, once FULLY warmed up as stated), 'Italian Tune-Up'.

 

[Intuit]

5,000 RPM / 60 Sec = 83.333 Rounds Per Second

That means your pistons moves up and down (with some lateral forces) 83 times in a single second or, one stroke in less than 0.01204 second. Over the long haul, regular redlining is going to make a difference.

There have been a number of times that I've been behind a routinely slow driver, that has decided to step on it for once and had noticed a puff of black carbon being expelled from the tail pipe. As long as you're not a "Sunday Driver" four days out of the week or using junk oil, you'll probably be okay.

 

[OffTheWall503]

THIS!^^^

But, even though the top tier fuel, and any GOOD, high PEA content additives (Red Line SI-1, Techron Complete, etc.) will never hurt, the only thing suggested above which will (or so I'm told) is the at least occasional (IF not EVERY time the car is driven, once FULLY warmed up as stated), 'Italian Tune-Up'.

I plan on using a bottle of the Redline Fuel System Cleaner once a year, mostly for the injectors sake.

 

[Initial_Will]

I too have been curious about this as well. I've talked to a few ford technicians as well through various means. The general consensus from what I personally gathered is you really aren't going to have to worry about this in anything less than 20k-30k. The build up that has been seen as early as 25k-40k on the fusions that use a similar platform but, people don't drive those very hard at all so it has more of a chance, per say, for the deposits to happen. As stated before, you can help prevent this condition as best as possible by top tier fuel, a catch can, some sort or aqua mist/meth injection, or the Italian tune up.
Due to the nature of the way the emissions systems recirculate the exhaust gases through the manifold (for those unfamiliar with that) is why this is actually a long term "problem" on any direct injected engine; as the vapors collect and harden onto the valves since there isn't anything to keep them clean like there is in port injection. One said manual cleaning is the usual option they do when this has been seen. Usually caused by a misfire or trouble code that is brought in for a check/repairs. I was also told to just "drive spiritedly" once or twice a week to help break these up, just in case that had a effect. So far, Mine are still fairly clean after 6600 miles. No catch can yet, and no aux fuel injection (although on the list of "To Do"). Just keep the maintenance up and I'm sure most of us will be perfectly fine, especially if all preventative measures are used. It won't stop it from happening but it'll definitely help reduce it, especially with the injectors getting dirty.

 

[Quisp]

You looked in the intake ports at 6600? Any pics ?

 

[Initial_Will]

You looked in the intake ports at 6600? Any pics ?

I didn't think about it at that moment so sadly no. Didn't think to keep documentation for a situation like this. I'll have to remember to make a video or pictures when I install the stratified aux fuel kit throttle body spacer for the 5th injector. I plan on that after I get my turbo upgrade around feb or march. Don't need it with the stock turbo. There are some cheap, decent endoscopes out there that you can get for around 20-30 bucks that are usb if you are really out to see. There were some small spots but nothing really worth noting, just typical valves with a light layer of carbon around the base of the valve stem. There really isn't alot of people talking about it with our cars...I'm guessing due to how we drive or people just don't look or get it looked at? Who knows. I can't really chime in completely since I'm not high mileage, but I definitely wanted to share some information. It's going to happen in some way due to the nature of everything. Even then, regular maintenance should make this a small issue if it's kept track of. Not everyone has the tools to document this though, so it would probably tend to go unnoticed unless it became a problem with engine operation. I'm used to port injection, as that's what was the normal for a long time on most of the cars I've worked on. So I have tried to gather all the information I can on DI being a owner of one so that maybe it'll help.

 

[KKaWing]

Here's mine @ 10 000 km taken April '15. I'll take a look again this next April with my cheapo boroscope.

http://imgur.com/a/Uq4jA

I have no clue which valve is for which cylinder. It really is a cheap floppy boroscope that I just snaked in through the MAP port. Whenever it ended up at a valve, I took a picture

 

[Quisp]

There's a board member with over 160k and no perceptible problem .

 

[M-Sport fan]

83.333 Rounds Per Second

Mil Spec Gatling Gun on slower speed?? LOL

 

[Intuit]

Mil Spec Gatling Gun on slower speed?? LOL

RPM = Rounds or Rotations Per Minute

There's a board member with over 160k and no perceptible problem .

He was probably running stock; not "tuned" or modified timings, intake, exhaust, etcetera.

We need to be mindful of whether or an engine with buildup, has been modified from stock; including ignition, fuel, and valve timings.

Modifications can have unintended consequences.

 

[M-Sport fan]

RPM = Rounds or Rotations Per Minute

I know PRECISELY what you meant, and was just (light-heartedly) razzing/busting you for using that terminology.

 

[M-Sport fan]

He was probably running stock; not "tuned" or modified timings, intake, exhaust, etcetera.

We need to be mindful of whether or an engine with buildup, has been modified from stock; including ignition, fuel, and valve timings.

Modifications can have unintended consequences.

Absolutely true, but, at least some on here seem to think that any auxiliary fueling (extra single regular fuel injector in intake manifold, WMI, or full race 4 added port injectors) actually keeps the intakes valves SPOTLESSLY clean.

So maybe some mods help?