Track Brake Pad Recommendations

[Switchback]

So I'm planning on tracking the Fiesta at Buttonwillow on May 10th. Originally I thought stock pads (Ford Summer compound) plus stock brake fluid would be good-enough but I've had a bit of a rude awakening after taking the Corvette to the track with stock pads and rotors and absolutely destroying said rotors. I've got Powerstop Drilled/Slotted rotors on the fiesta currently (Yes I know they likely will crack and fail quicker than blanks) but want some recommendations for pads. I've already purchased a motive bleeder (to helpfully limit some of the problems I had bleeding earlier) and will swap in Castrol SRF fluid. Yes it's overkill, but of everything that failed on the Corvette during my last track day braking-wise SRF worked like nothing happened. Plus parts commonality is nice.

Right now I'm looking at DTC-30s and Carbotech XP10 pads for both front and rear. When doing replacement-pad research for the Corvette I saw that the Hawk pads have a tendency to leave some pretty nasty brake dust that won't easily come off, at least when compared to the XP10s. I do plan on swapping back to the Ford OEM pads once I return home from track days so a full track pad is what I'm looking for (With the understanding the track pads need to at least semi-work on street as I drive up to the track). So what do people think pad wise?

Edit: Also worth noting I'm on 200TW RE-71RS Tires

 

[hawyee]

Gloc r14 are the best I've used on the bean.

 

[Fusion Works]

Lets stay away from using the OEM summer pads on track. It won't end well. DTC30 is too soft temp wise. Without brake ducts you are outside of their operating range. As mentioned before Gloc and Carbotech both make pads for track use, they aren't cheap. You could test the car out with DTC60s or 70s. Those are pretty reasonably priced, but make sure you clean the wheels ASAP as the dust can't stain your wheels if they get wet.

https://porterfield-brakes.com/search-result/?years=2017&make=19&model=5998&manufacturer=0

 

[Switchback]

Lets stay away from using the OEM summer pads on track. It won't end well. DTC30 is too soft temp wise. Without brake ducts you are outside of their operating range. As mentioned before Gloc and Carbotech both make pads for track use, they aren't cheap. You could test the car out with DTC60s or 70s. Those are pretty reasonably priced, but make sure you clean the wheels ASAP as the dust can't stain your wheels if they get wet.

https://porterfield-brakes.com/search-result/?years=2017&make=19&model=5998&manufacturer=0

That's why I posted, I realize after messing up the vette with stock pads that my idea of using stock pads and fluid is a stupid idea and only going to do more damage. Best thing I could do would be get a nice BBK (Like the Porsche BBK that Dialcaliper engineered) but with an uncertain date of when a second run is done I'm sticking with the stock calipers for the immediate future. I did see the DTC-30s have a way lower temp range than something like the Carbotech XP-10s.

Pricing wise the Carbotech and DTC-x are both similar in pricing, about 200 per axle from my quick search. Right now I'm leaning towards Carbotech XP-10s as that's what I plan to run in the Corvette when I take that back out to the track, and by going with Carbotech there's the added advantage of the 1521 Carbotech street pads are compatible with XP-10s without needing to re-bed etc.

 

[Fusion Works]

I switch back and forth between the Wilwood BP20 street pad and the BP30 /35 track pad. Never bother re-bedding. I am currently running the BP30 cuz I am too lazy to remove them between the last couple of events.

Don't think you can go wrong with the Carbotech pads.

 

[Switchback]

I switch back and forth between the Wilwood BP20 street pad and the BP30 /35 track pad. Never bother re-bedding. I am currently running the BP30 cuz I am too lazy to remove them between the last couple of events.

Don't think you can go wrong with the Carbotech pads.

You've got the Wilwood BBK right, the one that clears stock wheels? I was considering the Wilwood kit but the thinner rotor gave me a bit of pause.

 

[Fusion Works]

I have Wilwood parts, but it is no way an off the shelf kit. I the 6 piston Narrrow Superlite, with a 12.88 x 1.10 rotor and a floating hat. They do fine on track so far. I am feeding them with a 3in brake duct.

You are right to be concerned with the OTS Wilwood kit, its a bit more street duty. I think it could be made to work but you pretty much go away from mosst of the parts in the kit. Would need the heavier rotors, a thermolock pistons in the calipers.

 

[Fusion Works]

Scratch that. There is no reason to start with that kit. There isn't a heavy enough rotor for the capability of the car on track. They spec a 12.19 x .810 rotor and the best you can get is a 36 vane rotor. You need more mass.

This is what I am using.
https://www.wilwood.com/Rotors/RotorProd?itemno=160-12961&appid=0

You can see the difference in the rotors.
https://www.wilwood.com/BrakeKits/B...99&year=2014&make=Ford&model=Fiesta&option=ST

I think with my new extended ball joint pin, I may be able to get away with a 1.25in rotor.

 

[arlisscm]

Scratch that. There is no reason to start with that kit. There isn't a heavy enough rotor for the capability of the car on track. They spec a 12.19 x .810 rotor and the best you can get is a 36 vane rotor. You need more mass.

This is what I am using.
https://www.wilwood.com/Rotors/RotorProd?itemno=160-12961&appid=0

You can see the difference in the rotors.
https://www.wilwood.com/BrakeKits/B...99&year=2014&make=Ford&model=Fiesta&option=ST

I think with my new extended ball joint pin, I may be able to get away with a 1.25in rotor.

+1 On the off the shelf Wilwood kit being street oriented. I have been running it on track for a few years now, I installed the thermolock pistons and use spec37 rotors and DTC 60 (or 70) pads and I go through pads and rotors very quickly. They haven't failed me yet (probably helped by Worfab backer plates and cooling ducts), but only getting ~8 sessions on a set of pads and ~16-20 sessions out of the (upgraded) rotors isn't great. I'm likely upgrading to the Paragon/Alcon kit which is similar in size to that custom Wilwood setup. Back of the napkin math shows ~23% more area and ~36% more thickness on the pads, and rotors are ~36% thicker and ~7% larger in diameter. I run 17x9s with ET15-20 on my widebody setup so I have miles of clearance left.


Also agreed on staying away from DTC30s on the front (I still run them on the back, but its just kind of along for the ride). I ran them on the front with my Wilwood setup my first time tracking, and even being brand new to the track I wrecked the front pads (and rotors). They worked fine, but even though I was crazy slow there was nothing left after 8 sessions. I can imagine that it would be even worse with stock caliper and pad shape/size.

 

[Fusion Works]

Since you have a wide body you could build longer control arms and space the rear hubs out to take full advantage of the suspension geometry improvements. Now you have a horrible scrub radius, but with a 40ish offset you could get the lower ball joint where it belongs.

 

[Switchback]

Sounds like XP10s and fluid will be what I do next. I likely won't make too many more changes to the Fiesta now that I've got the corvette and I really need to work on the driver mod more than anything, and with the off the shelf kits being a bit mediocre I may just wait for an opportune time to pick up one of the Porsche retrofit kits.

 

[Fusion Works]

Yeah, as long as you can keep pad temps within there operating range you will be fine. Remove the backing plates to help get air to your brakes.

 

[Switchback]

Do you all think that just doing front XP10s and leaving the rears on the Ford OE brake pad would be fine, or should I just swap them both out?

 

[Fusion Works]

I am running OEM Ford Summer tire pads on the back and always have. Never had an issue with the rear brakes. I did pull the dust shields off when I first got the car to help get a little more air to the rotors. (Front and rear)

 

[Switchback]

I’m considering a set of these to replace the stock dust shields:
https://worfabrications.com/products/brake-ducting-shield

 

[Fusion Works]

They are way better than nothing, but they are a little on the small side in my opinion, but I made 3in inlets from the foglight holes.

 

[arlisscm]

I’m considering a set of these to replace the stock dust shields:
https://worfabrications.com/products/brake-ducting-shield

I run them with my Wilwood setup, just needed to trim them slightly for caliper clearance.

Seem to work just fine. I have 2 rectangular ducts in the lower air dam to feed them.

My biggest gripe is how the hoses get routed, but that's not a knock on the kit, just from the geometry of the car. The hose run above the control arm, beneath the axle shaft and sway bar, so they need to be held in place somewhat rigidly to not touch either of those, but still need to be able to move slightly to make up the difference in length when turning right or left.

I have an idea to 3D print a flattened connection (basically a coupler that has the regular 2" cylinder connections either end and smoothly transitions into a flatter section in the middle that has the same cross-sectional area) to connect from one side of the control arm to the other to mitigate this issue, just haven't gotten to it yet. I usually have to replace at least one of the hoses each season from getting rubbed through or kinked, but they aren't super expensive.

 

[Fusion Works]

BY ALL MEANS, make sure you keep that hose away from the CV axle boots. My cobbled together setup slipped after the last event and I didn't catch when started street driving the car again. Rubbed a small hole in the boot and now I have a mess and have to replace the boot. I am building some new mounts shortly to restraint my hoses better,

 

[arlisscm]

If all goes well with my first startup of my new engine this afternoon, I should be putting the face back on the car and hooking my ducting back up, I'll grab some pictures of my setup.

 

[arlisscm]

Pictures aren't great as it's a tough spot to get pictures of, but here's my setup for the routing. Trick is to have the big zip tie snug but not super tight and feed through the tube and hook it to the backer plate with that side turned so it's the furthest away it will be.