2015 FiST in Performance Blue replaced a Porsche
- Thread starter SigmaX
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#22
The Mini Cooper S Hardtop does very similar figures for a little bit more, pricewise. The FiST isn't a quick or fast car compared to most modern sportscars, but it is a hoot to drive and has a respectable amount of grunt due to that low-down torque. Stock for stock, you'd barely hold even with a V6 2010 Mustang - except top speed. The V6 was electronically limited to 114 MPH. The V8'd kick your butt.
Thread Starter
#24
Without looking at his build thread, that car is modified to a fair degree. Stock can do the quarter in 15.1 at 95. Also, that's a Fox body - definitely not a 2010. The third generation Mustang had a MASSIVE 225 HP in the highest-HP "5.0" model - I know, I had one. They run mid 14s in stock trim with a good launch.
Don't get me wrong, the FiST is a fun little hot hatch. But it's not a sports car. Let's not kid ourselves.
Don't get me wrong, the FiST is a fun little hot hatch. But it's not a sports car. Let's not kid ourselves.
Thread Starter
#26
Anything's quick if you throw enough money at it.
I think the real question will be "how stout are the stock internals"? I'd also like to see what people can do with variable-geometry turbos, as the 1.6L engine, in the end, only has 1.6L to push all that exhaust through the turbo. Variable geometry should help with low-end torque and spool time without sacrificing high-end power., but they take additional hardware and are harder to tune.
The DSM cars showed you could have a 700 HP 2.0L engine, as long as you were willing to have them up on a lift every other weekend and no power below 5.4K RPM. The more interesting ones were the disco potato machines, in my opinion.
I think the real question will be "how stout are the stock internals"? I'd also like to see what people can do with variable-geometry turbos, as the 1.6L engine, in the end, only has 1.6L to push all that exhaust through the turbo. Variable geometry should help with low-end torque and spool time without sacrificing high-end power., but they take additional hardware and are harder to tune.
The DSM cars showed you could have a 700 HP 2.0L engine, as long as you were willing to have them up on a lift every other weekend and no power below 5.4K RPM. The more interesting ones were the disco potato machines, in my opinion.
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The stock fist engine, stock from the throttle body to the oil pan has made 423whp with BPU and a bolt on turbo upgrade... And its 2700#.
I will concede the mini-coppers new engine make it a much more attractive car. Mostly because I believe its basically bmw's awesome N20-series motor that makes almost 300whp with just a tune and E85 in the other bmw cars ( I know this because I cross shopped a bmw X1 to the fist ). The issue with the mini, and it being more of a focus ST competitor ( aka, "punching above the fist weight" ) lies in its price. A base fist is $21,400 ( or so ). Show me a 8miles off the truck mini cooper S that doesn't say $28k-$30k next to it, or MUCH MUCH more if you start adding bmw options ( which can add up to more than the cost of 1/2 of a new fist actually ). Lets not even touch on the fact your not going to
Get special financing on a new
2016 mini cooper S or get the awesome rebates ford has. So comparing a $21k car to a $30k car does sort of make a difference when your spitting hairs like we do in the hot hatch segment. I am excited for the mini forks, it only took just short of 15 years to get them a real driveline, and it came with another 400lbs in weight over the OG supercharged models.
I have less than $2,000 in my entire build. I went 13.3@104+mph on $76 a piece street tires on a 233whp tune. I can make around 284whp with reasonable weather and unless I told you any different at all, I could say, "its a stock fiesta with an air intake, cheap exhaust, and china intercooler" (all true btw). I'd like my chances against a 2010 mustang from any kind of roll right now ( unless its a power adder car, let's be real ).
Like the OP said, it punches way above its weight. We are actually all sitting here talking about a crappy ford fiesta facing V8 rwd muscle cars, $30k german useless mini's, and having a 12sec capable car that could be modded for less than $2,000 that also retains good fuel mileage, good insurance rates, reliability, and the best part? Almost no one gives a crap about its straight line speed, owners mostly love it for its drive. I mean, jeezzz, I'm out there racing new audi S4's in a fiesta !! Lol.
Name anything that is in the $21k area that competes with the fist? Pretty sure most people would agree the mini/fost/gti are all in a higher class. Lets just say I haven't lost any sleep about what's happened ANYTIME I've ever lined up against any of those 3. Even though I'd like my chances against a normal caymen, gosh... I don't think I could let a caymen S go for a fist. Or a BMW 135i coupe.
I will concede the mini-coppers new engine make it a much more attractive car. Mostly because I believe its basically bmw's awesome N20-series motor that makes almost 300whp with just a tune and E85 in the other bmw cars ( I know this because I cross shopped a bmw X1 to the fist ). The issue with the mini, and it being more of a focus ST competitor ( aka, "punching above the fist weight" ) lies in its price. A base fist is $21,400 ( or so ). Show me a 8miles off the truck mini cooper S that doesn't say $28k-$30k next to it, or MUCH MUCH more if you start adding bmw options ( which can add up to more than the cost of 1/2 of a new fist actually ). Lets not even touch on the fact your not going to
Get special financing on a new
2016 mini cooper S or get the awesome rebates ford has. So comparing a $21k car to a $30k car does sort of make a difference when your spitting hairs like we do in the hot hatch segment. I am excited for the mini forks, it only took just short of 15 years to get them a real driveline, and it came with another 400lbs in weight over the OG supercharged models.
I have less than $2,000 in my entire build. I went 13.3@104+mph on $76 a piece street tires on a 233whp tune. I can make around 284whp with reasonable weather and unless I told you any different at all, I could say, "its a stock fiesta with an air intake, cheap exhaust, and china intercooler" (all true btw). I'd like my chances against a 2010 mustang from any kind of roll right now ( unless its a power adder car, let's be real ).
Like the OP said, it punches way above its weight. We are actually all sitting here talking about a crappy ford fiesta facing V8 rwd muscle cars, $30k german useless mini's, and having a 12sec capable car that could be modded for less than $2,000 that also retains good fuel mileage, good insurance rates, reliability, and the best part? Almost no one gives a crap about its straight line speed, owners mostly love it for its drive. I mean, jeezzz, I'm out there racing new audi S4's in a fiesta !! Lol.
Name anything that is in the $21k area that competes with the fist? Pretty sure most people would agree the mini/fost/gti are all in a higher class. Lets just say I haven't lost any sleep about what's happened ANYTIME I've ever lined up against any of those 3. Even though I'd like my chances against a normal caymen, gosh... I don't think I could let a caymen S go for a fist. Or a BMW 135i coupe.
Thread Starter
#30
I thought we were talking stock-for-stock. If you want to talk mods, then we can go back to that Foxbody earlier - buy one for 2K, put 4-5K into it, and be running low 11s. Like I said, you can throw enough money around to make anything quick. Is it cheap to mod a FiST? Hell yes, it's one of the (minor) reasons I bought it. Is it the cheapest drag-slip-to-dollar-ratio car out there? Hell, no. If you measure your car's worth by how fast they can get down the quarter-mile from a standstill, it's probably not the best place to start.
As for the Mini-to-FiST comparison - a well-equipped FiST from the factory (IE, the third out of the three factory option packages) will run you a MSRP of $25,500-ish. A similarly-equipped Mini Cooper S Hardtop is $26,500-ish; and for your extra $1,000 you do get a little extra.
Sourskittle, as I said earlier...I bought one. I considered a number of other cars - Ecoboost Mustang, GTI, WRX, BRZ/FRS, Mini - and the FiST was just fun. Barring a few issues, it's a great car to DD; and with some modifications for reliability, maybe a little power, and handling, I'll be able to get out of my own way on the racetrack reliably; and it's cheap to buy, own, and modify. However, I think it's pretty silly to try to turn it into a dragstrip battler. CAN you? Sure, people already are. SHOULD you, though? Well, that's personal preference. I'll never go to 400 HP on the FiST, because I care about engine response and turbo lag more than I care about maximum HP figures. Drag racing has never appealed to me. The first time I did it was at the insistence of some of my car-friends, and it was the last time; I ran a 12.9 in my BMW and then sat around and watched my friends with 1.8T and VR6 Volkswagens struggle to get into the 13s and break apart their "race" axles. You're talking like it's God's gift to motoring - maybe it is, for your purposes. But that doesn't mean it's the best car at that price point for every aspect of driving. You love it, I acknowledge that, but you gotta admit it has faults along with the positive points.
As for the Mini-to-FiST comparison - a well-equipped FiST from the factory (IE, the third out of the three factory option packages) will run you a MSRP of $25,500-ish. A similarly-equipped Mini Cooper S Hardtop is $26,500-ish; and for your extra $1,000 you do get a little extra.
Sourskittle, as I said earlier...I bought one. I considered a number of other cars - Ecoboost Mustang, GTI, WRX, BRZ/FRS, Mini - and the FiST was just fun. Barring a few issues, it's a great car to DD; and with some modifications for reliability, maybe a little power, and handling, I'll be able to get out of my own way on the racetrack reliably; and it's cheap to buy, own, and modify. However, I think it's pretty silly to try to turn it into a dragstrip battler. CAN you? Sure, people already are. SHOULD you, though? Well, that's personal preference. I'll never go to 400 HP on the FiST, because I care about engine response and turbo lag more than I care about maximum HP figures. Drag racing has never appealed to me. The first time I did it was at the insistence of some of my car-friends, and it was the last time; I ran a 12.9 in my BMW and then sat around and watched my friends with 1.8T and VR6 Volkswagens struggle to get into the 13s and break apart their "race" axles. You're talking like it's God's gift to motoring - maybe it is, for your purposes. But that doesn't mean it's the best car at that price point for every aspect of driving. You love it, I acknowledge that, but you gotta admit it has faults along with the positive points.
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I def agree. Its no drag racer. Simply agreeing with the OP, it does punch above its weight. And it def can punch above its weight for a couple bux in mods.
I've owned a foxbody ( 2. One 5.0L, one 2.3L turbo ). I swapped a efi 95' GT motor in my 2002 wrangler, lol. I know how good they can be for cheap. But just like a lot of modded up terminator owns would agree.... Its still a 1979 car under the skin. Super fast and fun and all. Just.... Kind of a tin can piece of crap that is entertaining ( I mean that with love actually ). But get into a terminator that runs 12.50, then get into a 335i that runs 12.50 and tell me they are similar vehicles. Lol. Samething thing for the fist. It maybe a lowly POS model, but its still light years ahead of modded up pre-2005 mustangs in the way it drives and feels.
I personally have a hard time seeing in my head, a truely stock 2005-2010 4.6L stang running anything faster than a 14.5. But I also see fost running high 15's and 16's. Fiesta's running 15.40s. And back in the day, lots of srt4's were running high 15's when my car was running 13.70 bone stock.
I'm the only person I know of, EVER to break a cv axle. I'm 100% sure that me driving it around with a broken cv boost for months pryer had something to do with it. I'm also 100% sure if someone made us a true engine mount solution ( aka more than one damn mount upgraded ) we wouldn't have issues breaking axles. Even better.... If we all used slicks when we goto the drag strip, I'm very sure we'd never see a broken axle.
The trans? Well... Mine is fantastic, and its put up with 354ft of torque at the wheels. And a fairly constant amount of reasonable power. Also. Lots of guys making 300whp or more with no issues. I really don't see reliability being an issue other than overheating, which in the grand scheme of this is an easy fix.
But I'm with you. I'll never see a 400whp fist in my driveway. And ironically the only reason I have track times at all is to document turbocharger upgrade progress. Same goes for getting on a dyno at all. I took the car on a 42mile "track" in the middle of no-where last Sunday and didn't race a soul. That's the drive that makes the car for me, not the stop watches. But the fact that is can be competitive at least, it pretty cool.
I've owned a foxbody ( 2. One 5.0L, one 2.3L turbo ). I swapped a efi 95' GT motor in my 2002 wrangler, lol. I know how good they can be for cheap. But just like a lot of modded up terminator owns would agree.... Its still a 1979 car under the skin. Super fast and fun and all. Just.... Kind of a tin can piece of crap that is entertaining ( I mean that with love actually ). But get into a terminator that runs 12.50, then get into a 335i that runs 12.50 and tell me they are similar vehicles. Lol. Samething thing for the fist. It maybe a lowly POS model, but its still light years ahead of modded up pre-2005 mustangs in the way it drives and feels.
I personally have a hard time seeing in my head, a truely stock 2005-2010 4.6L stang running anything faster than a 14.5. But I also see fost running high 15's and 16's. Fiesta's running 15.40s. And back in the day, lots of srt4's were running high 15's when my car was running 13.70 bone stock.
I'm the only person I know of, EVER to break a cv axle. I'm 100% sure that me driving it around with a broken cv boost for months pryer had something to do with it. I'm also 100% sure if someone made us a true engine mount solution ( aka more than one damn mount upgraded ) we wouldn't have issues breaking axles. Even better.... If we all used slicks when we goto the drag strip, I'm very sure we'd never see a broken axle.
The trans? Well... Mine is fantastic, and its put up with 354ft of torque at the wheels. And a fairly constant amount of reasonable power. Also. Lots of guys making 300whp or more with no issues. I really don't see reliability being an issue other than overheating, which in the grand scheme of this is an easy fix.
But I'm with you. I'll never see a 400whp fist in my driveway. And ironically the only reason I have track times at all is to document turbocharger upgrade progress. Same goes for getting on a dyno at all. I took the car on a 42mile "track" in the middle of no-where last Sunday and didn't race a soul. That's the drive that makes the car for me, not the stop watches. But the fact that is can be competitive at least, it pretty cool.
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