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Psa do not use motul in your fiesta st

babyivan

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I am easy to convince, all I want to know is where the mysterious TSB is. I Keep reading about it but all we can find is "so and so said" or "absolutely is one" but we can't seem to find the TSB. I figured someone would actually have a copy or know where to get one. But up to now it still seems to be hiding. Everyone is free to do what they want with their car. Until I see something from Ford I'll stick with what I do know. What I know is I have not seen one, I will not buy a service subscription to attempt to locate a copy. I will not request copies of all TSB's for all years ST's, wait 6-8 weeks for them and pay copy costs/postage from NHTSA.
Our transmission is used in millions of cars according to Getrag, now Magna PT. It is packaged to fit many makes but the mechanicals are the same. The fill level is probably set by Magna PT as is the fluid specs since they designed it. If it was a safety or reliability issue NHTSA would have forced a recall as required by law. Obviously Ford is NOT telling people to bring their cars in to fix an incorrect fluid level. I have not received an addendum to my manual changing the fluid level. So that should tell people that Ford/NHTSA does not see it as an issue. Neither do I.
Gotcha
 

babyivan

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....I lost my original trans running the OEM Ford DCTF at 6,000 miles due to output bearing shaft failure. 4,000 miles later on the new trans, I switched to Motul 300. I’m currently sitting at 70k miles with zero issues, and you know how much power I’m putting down, so I’d say you’re pretty safe with the Motul 300. I changed it for some fresh Motul at 50k, and noticed it had sheared down some.

Side note: When I drained to DCTF to put in the Motul 300, I actually drained 2.2L out of the trans. I called Ford and spoke to the master tech, who told me that when a FiST came in with a bad output bearing, they’re instructed by engineering to overfill the new trans. Apparently, the standard fill spec is a suspect in causing the bearing to fail. In any case, he told me to put at least 2L in, so that’s what I did. 2 full liters of Motul 300 went in, and again later when I put fresh fluid in. Like I said, zero issues all this time later, not even a leaky axle seal. Shifts smooth and quiet.
Found this
 
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Haha, I thought it looked familiar.
Actually, I’m the original poster of that. It was my trans that crapped the bed at 7k. As an update, yes, I’m still running Motul 300, and I’m now at 93k miles with zero issues.
On a side note; the reason that I know the 1.67L fill spec is wrong (besides Ford themselves telling me) is in the transmission fill procedure. It states to fil to 1” below the fill hole. If you were to follow that procedure and then immediately drain the transmission, you’d end up with roughly 2.2L, not 1.67.
 

babyivan

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Actually, I’m the original poster of that. It was my trans that crapped the bed at 7k. As an update, yes, I’m still running Motul 300, and I’m now at 93k miles with zero issues.
On a side note; the reason that I know the 1.67L fill spec is wrong (besides Ford themselves telling me) is in the transmission fill procedure. It states to fil to 1” below the fill hole. If you were to follow that procedure and then immediately drain the transmission, you’d end up with roughly 2.2L, not 1.67.
Totally!

I'm running a hair over 2L.
Changed out the FF at 7,500 miles.

A few things:

I had a hard time measuring that 1 inch below fill hole. Do you measure at a 90 degree angle or straight down???
Also, getting everything level was tricky.
In the end, I just put 2 liters in and walked away.

I went with the stock stuff, btw. I plan on doing the ravenol before summer.
 
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Totally!

I'm running a hair over 2L.
Changed out the FF at 7,500 miles.

A few things:

I had a hard time measuring that 1 inch below fill hole. Do you measure at a 90 degree angle or straight down???
Also, getting everything level was tricky.
In the end, I just put 2 liters in and walked away.

I went with the stock stuff, btw. I plan on doing the ravenol before summer.
The procedure was meant to be used by a technician, with the car level on a lift. As for what you can use to check 1”, you could use almost anything. I believe one guy bent some weedeater line at a 90 angle and trimmed one end to 1”, then used it as a dipstick of sorts, filling and checking until it showed up on the end of the line. In the end, when you fill to 1” below the fill hole, you’ll get roughly 2.2L. As for me, I just pour in 2L and call it good, and I’ve had no issues.
My personal opinion is that it’s less important about what you use, whether it’s stock, Motul, Ravenol, etc; and more important to use the proper amount of it.

As an aside, if your trans has already started to whine, no amount of fluid or brand change will save you. The damage has already been done, and it’s just a matter of time.
 

babyivan

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The procedure was meant to be used by a technician, with the car level on a lift. As for what you can use to check 1”, you could use almost anything. I believe one guy bent some weedeater line at a 90 angle and trimmed one end to 1”, then used it as a dipstick of sorts, filling and checking until it showed up on the end of the line. In the end, when you fill to 1” below the fill hole, you’ll get roughly 2.2L. As for me, I just pour in 2L and call it good, and I’ve had no issues.
My personal opinion is that it’s less important about what you use, whether it’s stock, Motul, Ravenol, etc; and more important to use the proper amount of it.

As an aside, if your trans has already started to whine, no amount of fluid or brand change will save you. The damage has already been done, and it’s just a matter of time.
Thankfully I did not have any noise.
 

TyphoonFiST

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Does anyone know if you fill it to the "top" aka have it drip out, much much do you have to pull back out?
Just fill it with 2 Qts. Of the fluid of your choice....Then Call it a day....its not a Tiptronic transmission from Porsche....then let it buck!


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jmrtsus

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Actually, I’m the original poster of that. It was my trans that crapped the bed at 7k. As an update, yes, I’m still running Motul 300, and I’m now at 93k miles with zero issues.
On a side note; the reason that I know the 1.67L fill spec is wrong (besides Ford themselves telling me) is in the transmission fill procedure. It states to fil to 1” below the fill hole. If you were to follow that procedure and then immediately drain the transmission, you’d end up with roughly 2.2L, not 1.67.
How do you contact a Master Tech at Ford? Any numbers or such? Bet they could get us a copy of the TSB.
 
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How do you contact a Master Tech at Ford? Any numbers or such? Bet they could get us a copy of the TSB.
Any decent-sized Ford dealership is likely to have a master or senior master tech in their employ. I called the dealership which warrantied my transmission and wanted to know why they had overfilled it. To which his reply was that instructions came with the new transmission from Ford Engineering to ignore the fill spec limit and to fill according to the procedure. Which came out to a little over 2L. I don’t remember him mentioning a TSB on it, but that doesn’t surprise me. I work for a major automotive supplier and these types of “engineering directives” aren’t uncommon. Like us, I’m sure that Ford and Getrag has warranty engineers who’s purpose is to investigate root causes of warranty returns and insert countermeasures as needed. I don’t know the percentage of transmission bearing failures, but seeing as how it isn’t a safety critical situation and it’s such low volume, I doubt a TSB will be issued.

At the end of the day, it’s your car. If you want to stick with the 1.67L/150,000 mile fluid lifespan, then great. You’re doing what you’re told to do by Ford. If you wanna fill according to the procedure, which means 2L, then also great. You’re also doing what you’re told to do by Ford. I’m not here to tell you what’s right or wrong, I’m simply telling you my experience with my car. Considering I lost my first 1.67L-filled trans at 6k with an all stock setup, and I have 83,000 miles on my 2L-filled (by Ford) 2nd trans, I’ll be sticking with 2L. Especially considering most of my 2nd transmission’s life has been spent coping with 300+whp. It’s just my opinion tho.
 

TyphoonFiST

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Any decent-sized Ford dealership is likely to have a master or senior master tech in their employ. I called the dealership which warrantied my transmission and wanted to know why they had overfilled it. To which his reply was that instructions came with the new transmission from Ford Engineering to ignore the fill spec limit and to fill according to the procedure. Which came out to a little over 2L. I don’t remember him mentioning a TSB on it, but that doesn’t surprise me. I work for a major automotive supplier and these types of “engineering directives” aren’t uncommon. Like us, I’m sure that Ford and Getrag has warranty engineers who’s purpose is to investigate root causes of warranty returns and insert countermeasures as needed. I don’t know the percentage of transmission bearing failures, but seeing as how it isn’t a safety critical situation and it’s such low volume, I doubt a TSB will be issued.

At the end of the day, it’s your car. If you want to stick with the 1.67L/150,000 mile fluid lifespan, then great. You’re doing what you’re told to do by Ford. If you wanna fill according to the procedure, which means 2L, then also great. You’re also doing what you’re told to do by Ford. I’m not here to tell you what’s right or wrong, I’m simply telling you my experience with my car. Considering I lost my first 1.67L-filled trans at 6k with an all stock setup, and I have 83,000 miles on my 2L-filled (by Ford) 2nd trans, I’ll be sticking with 2L. Especially considering most of my 2nd transmission’s life has been spent coping with 300+whp. It’s just my opinion tho.
Miss trouble....how in the Sam hell do you have 93k on your FiST already? I remember when you joined! That's totally cray cray!




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Miss trouble....how in the Sam hell do you have 93k on your FiST already? I remember when you joined! That's totally cray cray!


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Cuz I’m gangsta! Lol!

Seriously tho, I drive a 65mile daily round trip to work and back, and I work 6 days a week most of the time. Plus, factor in drives to car events in Dallas, which is 1.5hrs one way, cruises, etc. it all adds up.
 

babyivan

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How do you contact a Master Tech at Ford? Any numbers or such? Bet they could get us a copy of the TSB.
Focus on this part.

On a side note; the reason that I know the 1.67L fill spec is wrong (besides Ford themselves telling me) is in the transmission fill procedure. It states to fill to 1” below the fill hole. If you were to follow that procedure and then immediately drain the transmission, you’d end up with roughly 2.2L, not 1.67.
You can't go wrong here if you follow the factory service manual's method of filling the gearbox. It won't really matter what the "spec" volume number is.
 

TyphoonFiST

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Cuz I’m gangsta! Lol!

Seriously tho, I drive a 65mile daily round trip to work and back, and I work 6 days a week most of the time. Plus, factor in drives to car events in Dallas, which is 1.5hrs one way, cruises, etc. it all adds up.
Mines a 15 ...just turned 50k...and I've driven to the Keys in Fl from Mn....I thought I put miles on mine....cripes! Keep on rocking in the free world!




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danbfree

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The procedure was meant to be used by a technician, with the car level on a lift. As for what you can use to check 1”, you could use almost anything. I believe one guy bent some weedeater line at a 90 angle and trimmed one end to 1”, then used it as a dipstick of sorts, filling and checking until it showed up on the end of the line. In the end, when you fill to 1” below the fill hole, you’ll get roughly 2.2L. As for me, I just pour in 2L and call it good, and I’ve had no issues.
My personal opinion is that it’s less important about what you use, whether it’s stock, Motul, Ravenol, etc; and more important to use the proper amount of it.

As an aside, if your trans has already started to whine, no amount of fluid or brand change will save you. The damage has already been done, and it’s just a matter of time.
Agree that the amount is most important, can't agree that once the whine starts then the damage is done, I noticed mine started whining a bit since pretty much brand new but since I changed it out with a full 2L at 12k miles it fixed it, period. In other words, a mild whine when near new may be literally from being low on fluid, so taking care of it right away is the best thing to do.
 

jmrtsus

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Any decent-sized Ford dealership is likely to have a master or senior master tech in their employ. I called the dealership which warrantied my transmission and wanted to know why they had overfilled it. To which his reply was that instructions came with the new transmission from Ford Engineering to ignore the fill spec limit and to fill according to the procedure. Which came out to a little over 2L. I don’t remember him mentioning a TSB on it, but that doesn’t surprise me. I work for a major automotive supplier and these types of “engineering directives” aren’t uncommon. Like us, I’m sure that Ford and Getrag has warranty engineers who’s purpose is to investigate root causes of warranty returns and insert countermeasures as needed. I don’t know the percentage of transmission bearing failures, but seeing as how it isn’t a safety critical situation and it’s such low volume, I doubt a TSB will be issued.

At the end of the day, it’s your car. If you want to stick with the 1.67L/150,000 mile fluid lifespan, then great. You’re doing what you’re told to do by Ford. If you wanna fill according to the procedure, which means 2L, then also great. You’re also doing what you’re told to do by Ford. I’m not here to tell you what’s right or wrong, I’m simply telling you my experience with my car. Considering I lost my first 1.67L-filled trans at 6k with an all stock setup, and I have 83,000 miles on my 2L-filled (by Ford) 2nd trans, I’ll be sticking with 2L. Especially considering most of my 2nd transmission’s life has been spent coping with 300+whp. It’s just my opinion tho.
I'm sorry I thought you talked to FoMoCo not the dealer.........still looking for something from Ford saying the fill level is incorrect in our cars. I'm glad things worked out well for you. The dealer is not "Ford" they are a Ford authorized Dealership. When you say you spoke with "Ford" that would imply an actual Ford employee. That is what is missing in this picture, I was sure you talked to a dealer "tech" certainly not Ford. Thanks for your input.
 

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