TEI Racing BBK info

[Ludeem1]

Btw. Who is hank ? Edit, I know who hank is he’s the TEI rep. Dumb me

 

[the duke]

View attachment 53303

What are the numbers on the rear of the caliper? Run those and see what they say.

Interesting process. Painting after being fully assembled...

 

[LilPartyBox]

Here's some photos. Lets just say I'm not happy. The finish is a light blue. Doesn't match pictures on site for finish. Obviously different brake retention design. One of hte pads friction material was damaged, and the screw doesn't sit flush. Hopefully I can just get my money back for the brakes and spacers and be done with this adventure. This is all pictures from the one caliper I unwrapped from the shrinkwrap.

Out of the box paint was already chipped on the end of the big bolt on top of the caliper. You can see it in the pictures. I wasn’t too concerned as you can’t really tell when it’s on the car. Also when I opened the box it smelled like paint. I wonder if the paint wasn’t cured and when I took the shrink wrap off it stuck to the paint and chipped it

This is exactly why ISO certs matter. If the quality of the paint is this inconsistent, ya gotta ask where else did they fuck up? Let's focus on the very scary quality issue pointed out by @thecman02 .

Notice the screws on both the calipers. Let's start with the two center-most screws. On neither caliper are those screws fully seated. I thought, maybe that's by design. But then looking at the backside of the yellow caliper you can see that those center-most screws still have a ways to go! Again, maybe by design but then look at the outermost screws on the same yellow caliper - fully seated. Now the scary part - the outer screws on the blue caliper are NOT fully seated as they are on the yellow one.....yea, they didn't fully assemble the blue caliper. Furthermore, I respectfully submit that the center screws also prove that neither caliper is fully assembled. I mean, why wouldn't you fully seat screws holding a goddam caliper together?.....because they are rushing them out with little to no quality control.

If only there was some governing body that could encourage proper quality control? Send those calipers back fellas!

@Ludeem1 Wilwood is a great choice. Also ISO certified, go figure. Let us know if you find the street seals for the pistons! lol

I just emailed Ron. I told him about the different pad retention and paint chip. I told him I want to return the kit. Hoping he lets me return it. I also have to return the EBC brakes that didn’t fit. If he tries to send me the kit the others have gotten I will decline. I decided I will go with Wilwood

You all know I'm not Whoosh's BIGGEST fan but I respect what he's done for our platform. I spend lots of time daydreaming on his website! . I also have no doubt he WILL absolutely do right by you guys. He may eventually ban my IP from his website, but you guys will be good lol

Ya I am not going to yell at you in the other thread Maybe Hank sent some of the wrong Calipers to Ron and Ron sent them out to Ludeem without opening because pallet of Caliper boxes all look the same outside says 330mm Big Brake.
It happens in shipping.
Rebranding is nothing new and lots of people do it. I also cannot blame anyone for not wanting to tell people who their source is. Common business rebrand practice . Car guys just tend to get nosy about this stuff.
Anyways interesting convo and back to your end goal.

I won't argue rebranding. My Cobb sways are clearly Eibach. But are you starting to see why I was so concerned about the source of this life saving part? My life would be in the hands of this caliper & it obviously has some issues. From QC to just sending customers the entirely wrong part.
Run for your lives people. And make sure your shoes are ISO certified so can stop yourself

...
Interesting process. Painting after being fully assembled...

I thought the same thing when i first saw them on Ron's site. I can only assume they throw the caliper together, spray the WHOLE thing down - even the pistons by the pics we have in this thread - and then bake and ship. Those small chips of paint on the pistons can potentially get into the hydraulics!!!! They obviously don't check the bolts to preserve their paint job...

Notice Tarox and Wilwood ISO certified calipers below. Neither bolts or the hydraulic line are painted & the pistons are CLEAN. They were assembled with care...

 

[LilPartyBox]

HANK'S RESPONSE

1. Would your price include US import and Chinese export costs?
   • This price is only product price,not including any other charges cost.Actually, in this price,we dont have much profit.But because there are too many imitation products now, their prices are too cheap, and we have to use such a price to compete with them.
2. You recommended a 330mm but in the email subject you say 285mm. Are both rotor sizes are available for Ford Fiesta ST kit? How many other sizes are available for my car?
   • The rotor size is depend on car rim size. I think all you know that we must to make sure our brake kit will fit your car rim.Such like your car rim is R17,so we will prepare 330 mm rotor for you.But why we choose 330 mm rotor for you rather than 285 mm rotor? Because We will also consider appearance issues.Looking at the wheels, the fuller brake kit is more beautiful.What do you or your guys think?
   • What if we are concerned with weight? Our cars are small and the largest, "best looking" rotor isn't the priority. The smaller 300mm option would weigh less and because the Fiesta doesn't weigh much, wouldn't significantly hurt stopping distances.
3. Does your kit have different calipers for each rotor size or is the caliper the same for all rotors?
   • We have different calipers. Because of different caliper parameter, we will prepare different rotor size for them. Such like the caliper i choose for you, actually, there are only two sets for rotor size for it,300 mm or 330 mm. But as for other 6 piston caliper,we will prepare 355,378 [or] even 405 mm rotor.
4. Do the pistons on the calipers have seals? Some brakes don’t. Wilwood, for example. What is the maximum temp the piston seals can withstand?
   • All of our calipers have the seals.For driving on the street,180°C .For racing,220 °C.
5. What is the caliper made of? Weight?
   • 6068 or 7075 Aviation aluminum alloy, Actually, we are very confident for our caliper. It has three years warranty. Different caliper has different weight. For the caliper what i choose for you, it is 3.1KG/pieces [6.83 lbs]
6. Is the caliper a monoblock design or split?
   • We have both.The monoblock design caliper will be more costly than split.
7. Are the calipers anodized or powder coated?
   • We have only one model caliper is printed by anodized. As for the rest, they are all printed by high-temp stoving finish [stoving enamel]
8. How many vanes per rotor?
   • For 355, 378, 380 and 405 mm rotor, 72 vanes. For 285,300,330,345 mm rotor, only 36-48 vanes.
9. Are the rotor vanes directional?
   • Back
   • WTF does that mean? The vanes are leaning back?
10. And finally, do you guys participate in or sponsor any sanctioned racing?
    • It depends on whether we have this ability and whether the team meets our sponsorship requirements.

Because you and your guys have questioned the quality of our products because of the price of the product, I need to explain it.
Because in the brake kit market, there are not only brand products, but also many imitation products.
As a small brand company, our main competitors are now imitation products.
Therefore, we have to reduce profits to expand market sales. This is not the result we want, but at present, we can only do this.
We will increase the price of products this year because our products have been upgraded, whether it is brake pads, brake discs, piston materials, etc.
Thank you very much for your attention for TeiRacing.
Our company will work hard to make better products and provide better services.

MY RESPONSE

Thank you for such detailed answers! The kit sounds amazing. Please let me know when you are ISO certified. There is a good amount of interest with my fellow Fiesta ST owners. If you are interested, I’d like to work together with you on setting up a group buy for my forum. If it goes well, we can expand that to the Miata community. Let me know what your team thinks about it. Thanks.

He glazed over my request for a sample kit and the GB. Not surprising tho as he knows we want ISO and they don't have it yet. Also, I'm not certain I would install it anyway after seeing the pics of calipers not fully assembled. I'm not saying Whoosh = TEI. Just that in general, an off-brand kit without any certs is scary. Being a test pilot is for the young and the single lol

Otherwise the specs of the kit have definitely piqued my interest. If the new pricing of their ISO cert kit is around or less than Wilwood, I would buy this kit. If they price them at StopTech or go nuts to compete with AP, then Wilwood it is for me.

But at this junction it may make sense for any others interested in pursuing this kit to also email him at sales02@teiracing.com. Site this thread and our possible commitment to a GB should they become ISO certified. Hopefully we will be their first platform to penetrate the "USA supermarket", as he put it.

 

[esp_martin]

Placeholder....Hank responded

giving me time to make some popcorn. thanks.

 

[Ludeem1]

Holy crap I just noticed the blue calipers and those screws not all the way in. Even if we get the caliper that everyone else gets I’m waiting for those then selling this kit. Not gonna screw anyone over.

 

[esp_martin]

HANK'S RESPONSE

1. Would your price include US import and Chinese export costs?
2. You recommended a 330mm but in the email subject you say 285mm. Are both rotor sizes are available for Ford Fiesta ST kit? How many other sizes are available for my car?
   • 
     
   • What if we are concerned with weight? Our cars are small and the largest, "best looking" rotor isn't the priority. The smaller 300mm option would weigh less and because the Fiesta doesn't weigh much, wouldn't significantly hurt stopping distances.
3. Does your kit have different calipers for each rotor size or is the caliper the same for all rotors?
4. Do the pistons on the calipers have seals? Some brakes don’t. Wilwood, for example. What is the maximum temp the piston seals can withstand?
5. What is the caliper made of? Weight?
6. Is the caliper a monoblock design or split?
7. Are the calipers anodized or powder coated?
8. How many vanes per rotor?
9. Are the rotor vanes directional?
   • 
     
   • WTF does that mean? The vanes are leaning back?
10. And finally, do you guys participate in or sponsor any sanctioned racing?

MY RESPONSE


He glazed over my request for a sample kit and the GB. Not surprising tho as he knows we want ISO and they don't have it yet. Also, I'm not certain I would install it anyway after seeing the pics of calipers not fully assembled. I'm not saying Whoosh = TEI. Just that in general, an off-brand kit without any certs is scary. Being a test pilot is for the young and the single lol

Otherwise the specs of the kit have definitely piqued my interest. If the new pricing of their ISO cert kit is around or less than Wilwood, I would buy this kit. If they price them at StopTech or go nuts to compete with AP, then Wilwood it is for me.

But at this junction it may make sense for any others interested in pursuing this kit to also email him at sales02@teiracing.com. Site this thread and our possible commitment to a GB should they become ISO certified. Hopefully we will be their first platform to penetrate the "USA supermarket", as he put it.

My two cents:

- 300mm option would far and away be the best GB as I would think a lot of people here run 16in rims and for us 17in crowd would have no problem with a little less weight (I would even argue 285mm is the best choice but that doesn't look to be an option in future builds)
- "back" might be literally something lost in translation and he's just agreeing that the vanes are directional and choosing an inaccurate word to describe the vane direction

edit: as for what Hank is complaining about, i have no doubt that whomever TEI had build these kits just let other Chinese knock-offs copy the plans and run with it. i mean Chinese companies stealing IP isn't anything knew. whether TEI was the original company or not is something we probably won't ever know but if TEI is willing to get ISO certified that does say something for how seriously they want to be taken.

I mean we can't even say for sure if TEI is providing Whoosh's BBKs. They could all just be coming from the same production facility and TEI could have a deal with the facility that they can reproduce TEI's idea with only slight changes and sell it to other company's and Whoosh is getting them after the fact. And with how China enforces their post-COVID visits there's probably no way to have surprise inspections to see what's going on in production to confirm. FWIW, Hank's frustration makes sense and he's not dodging questions the way I was worried he would.

edit edit: I agree that a racing team running TEI BBKs on a hatchback would be the best way to know how these things work IRL but seems like they don't sponsor anyone. That's a real shame as that would be great advertising as we would then know how it holds up. It'd be great if someone who runs this as a track only car would even test out a TEI kit. I found out about 2Forge wheels b/c a racing team out of England slapped them on their VW diesel race build and a full race season's worth of YT videos made me a believer in those wheels. Hopefully TEI can find a team in Europe to try out their brakes.

 

[Dpro]

My two cents:

- 300mm option would far and away be the best GB as I would think a lot of people here run 16in rims and for us 17in crowd would have no problem with a little less weight (I would even argue 285mm is the best choice but that doesn't look to be an option in future builds)
- "back" might be literally something lost in translation and he's just agreeing that the vanes are directional and choosing an inaccurate word to describe the vane direction

edit: as for what Hank is complaining about, i have no doubt that whomever TEI had build these kits just let other Chinese knock-offs copy the plans and run with it. i mean Chinese companies stealing IP isn't anything knew. whether TEI was the original company or not is something we probably won't ever know but if TEI is willing to get ISO certified that does say something for how seriously they want to be taken.

I mean we can't even say for sure if TEI is providing Whoosh's BBKs. They could all just be coming from the same production facility and TEI could have a deal with the facility that they can reproduce TEI's idea with only slight changes and sell it to other company's and Whoosh is getting them after the fact. And with how China enforces their post-COVID visits there's probably no way to have surprise inspections to see what's going on in production to confirm. FWIW, Hank's frustration makes sense and he's not dodging questions the way I was worried he would.

edit edit: I agree that a racing team running TEI BBKs on a hatchback would be the best way to know how these things work IRL but seems like they don't sponsor anyone. That's a real shame as that would be great advertising as we would then know how it holds up. It'd be great if someone who runs this as a track only car would even test out a TEI kit. I found out about 2Forge wheels b/c a racing team out of England slapped them on their VW diesel race build and a full race season's worth of YT videos made me a believer in those wheels. Hopefully TEI can find a team in Europe to try out their brakes.

A Few logical conclusions about all of this.
A: It’s obvious TEI is making the Whoosh Calipers because Ludeem got Whoosh branded Calipers loaded with TEI pads and TEI advertises on their own site top to bottom complete sets, Not separates, i.e. , Caliper, rotor, pads, lines!
Now I honestly also can tell you my calipers look to be of better quality than Ludeems. . If I had seem seen stuff like what is obvious on Ludeems they would not even have gone on my car.

B. They are not ISO certified which Lilpartybox seeems to be putting the most importance on.
I can honestly say I may not agree with his consensus that ISO certified automatically spells quantity in part!
One only has to look at Rota who has been ISO 9001 for over 30 years now yet their rims can and do break when struck rather than always bending . What is more crash worthy a bent wheel or a wheel that cracks and breaks ? That is left up to you to consider.
Of course I will add Rota is now getting into the flow formed game which should bring a much better product as flow formed is much better than cast.

C. Hank while being nice even in his own discussions seems to be pushing larger rotors for the sake of looks i.e. form over function. THAT to me throws up warning flags about TEI in general as they really are not approaching it from a functioning engineering aspect.

Given all of this , I would buy the product from Ron before buying the product directly because all go backs and issues would be dealt with someone here in the U.S.

I am not sure any of you are aware what it’s like to buy products direct from China in bulk and dealing with Chinese companies in general. Things can change fast and overnight . I am not saying everything out of China is garbage it’s not . I am saying it has been the wild west of capitalism over there for the last 15-20 years and it’s an anything goes situation.

Companies are willing to manufacture say 2000 pieces of something for anyone as long as it’s paid for regardless of if the product is sold . I.E. you buy it you own it end of story . Warranties are great as long as they are exercised properly .

Back in the day I worked for an auto parts wholesaler who sold a crap company with a lifetime warranty on water pumps . Warranty amounted to shit because products broke and needed to be replaced. Guess what not was warrantied? Time and expenses to remove and replace said product .

One has to look at all of this before investing in a product or trusting a product and guess what again has nothing to do with ISO certification. A company can still make crap on a ISO certified facility . It’s not the be all end all statement to quality that some here seem to place.
I cannot stop reiterating that point because I feel it’s so lost on some here.

So all in all I would not buy from TEI.

 

[esp_martin]

A Few logical conclusions about all of this.
A: It’s obvious TEI is making the Whoosh Calipers because Ludeem got Whoosh branded Calipers loaded with TEI pads and TEI advertises on their own site top to bottom complete sets, Not separates, i.e. , Caliper, rotor, pads, lines!
Now I honestly also can tell you my calipers look to be of better quality than Ludeems. . If I had seem seen stuff like what is obvious on Ludeems they would not even have gone on my car.

B. They are not ISO certified which Lilpartybox seeems to be putting the most importance on.
I can honestly say I may not agree with his consensus that ISO certified automatically spells quantity in part!
One only has to look at Rota who has been ISO 9001 for over 30 years now yet their rims can and do break when struck rather than always bending . What is more crash worthy a bent wheel or a wheel that cracks and breaks ? That is left up to you to consider.
Of course I will add Rota is now getting into the flow formed game which should bring a much better product as flow formed is much better than cast.

C. Hank while being nice even in his own discussions seems to be pushing larger rotors for the sake of looks i.e. form over function. THAT to me throws up warning flags about TEI in general as they really are not approaching it from a functioning engineering aspect.

Given all of this , I would buy the product from Ron before buying the product directly because all go backs and issues would be dealt with someone here in the U.S.

I am not sure any of you are aware what it’s like to buy products direct from China in bulk and dealing with Chinese companies in general. Things can change fast and overnight . I am not saying everything out of China is garbage it’s not . I am saying it has been the wild west of capitalism over there for the last 15-20 years and it’s an anything goes situation.

pp.s.

Companies are willing to manufacture say 2000 pieces of something for anyone as long as it’s paid for regardless of if the product is sold . I.E. you buy it you own it end of story . Warranties are great as long as they are exercised properly .

Back in the day I worked for an auto parts wholesaler who sold a crap company with a lifetime warranty on water pumps . Warranty amounted to shit because products broke and needed to be replaced. Guess what not was warrantied? Time and expenses to remove and replace said product .

One has to look at all of this before investing in a product or trusting a product and guess what again has nothing to do with ISO certification. A company can still make crap on a ISO certified facility . It’s not the be all end all statement to quality that some here seem to place.
I cannot stop reiterating that point because it’s so lost on some here.

So all in all I would not buy from TEI.

Okay, I'm a push back here.

You say China capitalism is the Wild West in that "anything goes". And I completely agree.

So while some things have TEI branded parts on them, we have *no idea* if the production facility that makes the TEI calipers: 1) stops the line after making TEI's parts 2) starts it back up to make their "own calipers" reusing TEI's specs but just speeding up the line to breakneck speeds 3) slapping TEI branded parts on the pieces of the kit they don't manufacturer (e.g. the pads) 4) drop ship selling them for companies like Whoosh who don't have the capability to do surprise inspections at the facility

And of course Hank is going to push bigger calipers. Go to the big forged rim companies and demand a 16x8 or 15in rim for their biggest lines and get laughed out of the room. If you want 15 or 16in forged wheels, you're going to pay a lot of money because only custom shops are going to make them. Most don't make them below 18, full stop. So TEI is looking at the market and they see people willing to drop serious money on BBKs are the ones with 17+in rims. That's just how capitalism/productions works. So of course Hank is gonna be like "please buy the bigger calipers, [because we don't want to make smaller ones]".

For clarity: *I'm agreeing with everything you're saying on not trusting TEI Racing because we don't have visibility on their process*. Which is why @LilPartyBox and I agree that TEI sponsoring a race team (ideally a lightly modified FWD vehicle) would go miles in proving whether their BBK holds up or not. I just don't agree with how you took opinions and presented them as facts.

We agree on not trusting TEI enough to just throw their BBKs on our rides without them jumping through a lot of hoops. ISO is just the first step. Sponsoring a team and seeing the results is the big one for me.

p.s. props to you on the Rota observation which again reinforces the sponsorship with a race team; i steered clear of their cast wheels because of tuners like you @Dpro which is also why i stopped trying to coordinate a group buy for Titan7 forged wheels (apparently they too break under heavy load in track conditions)

 

[M-Sport fan]

After reading all of this, IF I ever had the overwhelming desire to put a fixed caliper kit on my ride, I will save up very slowly, and get the M-Sport R2 AP Racing, or Alcon gravel setup, which I know will go inside every wheel I own, or ever will own, without any spacers.

 

[Dpro]

Okay, I'm a push back here.

You say China capitalism is the Wild West in that "anything goes". And I completely agree.

So while some things have TEI branded parts on them, we have *no idea* if the production facility that makes the TEI calipers: 1) stops the line after making TEI's parts 2) starts it back up to make their "own calipers" reusing TEI's specs but just speeding up the line to breakneck speeds 3) slapping TEI branded parts on the pieces of the kit they don't manufacturer (e.g. the pads) 4) drop ship selling them for companies like Whoosh who don't have the capability to do surprise inspections at the facility

And of course Hank is going to push bigger calipers. Go to the big forged rim companies and demand a 16x8 or 15in rim for their biggest lines and get laughed out of the room. If you want 15 or 16in forged wheels, you're going to pay a lot of money because only custom shops are going to make them. Most don't make them below 18, full stop. So TEI is looking at the market and they see people willing to drop serious money on BBKs are the ones with 17+in rims. That's just how capitalism/productions works. So of course Hank is gonna be like "please buy the bigger calipers, [because we don't want to make smaller ones]".

For clarity: *I'm agreeing with everything you're saying on not trusting TEI Racing because we don't have visibility on their process*. Which is why @LilPartyBox and I agree that TEI sponsoring a race team (ideally a lightly modified FWD vehicle) would go miles in proving whether their BBK holds up or not. I just don't agree with how you took opinions and presented them as facts.

We agree on not trusting TEI enough to just throw their BBKs on our rides without them jumping through a lot of hoops. ISO is just the first step. Sponsoring a team and seeing the results is the big one for me.

p.s. props to you on the Rota observation which again reinforces the sponsorship with a race team; i steered clear of their cast wheels because of tuners like you @Dpro which is also why i stopped trying to coordinate a group buy for Titan7 forged wheels (apparently they too break under heavy load in track conditions)

My comment about Hank pushing bigger rotors Calipers are the same size the bigger brake thing is based on using different sized brackets to accommodate larger rotors is based purely on his own comment about looking better. In the email clip that lilpartybox posted.
I was not not so much stating as facts as bullet pointing conclusions which are my opinion in the discussion.

 

[esp_martin]

After reading all of this, IF I ever had the overwhelming desire to put a fixed caliper kit on my ride, I will save up very slowly, and get the M-Sport R2 AP Racing, or Alcon gravel setup, which I know will go inside every wheel I own, or ever will own, without any spacers.

well we just need to wait until the British Pound drops below the dollar and...still pay more the BBK then a full turbo system

AP Racing brake kit: Ford Fiesta Mk7 ST180 315x24mm (black calipers) (burtonpower.com)

you weren't kidding on the price. geez. also only comes in 17in rotor. which doesn't bother me!

 

[esp_martin]

My comment about Hank pushing bigger rotors Calipers are the same size the bigger brake thing is based on using different sized brackets to accommodate larger rotors is based purely on his own comment about looking better. In the email clip that lilpartybox posted.
I was not not so much stating as facts as bullet pointing conclusions which are my opinion in the discussion.

Fair points. and regardless we came to the same conclusion. it'll be interesting to see if TEI does improve their production quality as I hope this will benefit Whoosh at least.

 

[Ludeem1]

Ron sent out a return label and I will be getting a full refund.

 

[M-Sport fan]

well we just need to wait until the British Pound drops below the dollar and...still pay more the BBK then a full turbo system

AP Racing brake kit: Ford Fiesta Mk7 ST180 315x24mm (black calipers) (burtonpower.com)

you weren't kidding on the price. geez. also only comes in 17in rotor. which doesn't bother me!

Their R2 gravel kit is a MUCH smaller rotor size (like a 285mm maximum diameter) than that kit, as it MUST fit into narrow width/fairly high ET number, 15" gravel wheels as used, and mandated by international (FIA) rally rules.

It might be even more yet in co$t than that 17" wheel required, 'street' kit on that site, given it is bespoke made for M-Sport by AP Racing.

Also; unless one can find great replacement hats (and therefore rings as well?) for the gravel kit, they would have to convert to a 5 lug pattern, as everything rally spec for Fiestas is now 5 bolt ONLY (even the lowest performance R2 spec cars).

 

[LilPartyBox]

A Few logical conclusions about all of this.
A: It’s obvious TEI is making the Whoosh Calipers because Ludeem got Whoosh branded Calipers loaded with TEI pads and TEI advertises on their own site top to bottom complete sets, Not separates, i.e. , Caliper, rotor, pads, lines!
Now I honestly also can tell you my calipers look to be of better quality than Ludeems. . If I had seem seen stuff like what is obvious on Ludeems they would not even have gone on my car.

B. They are not ISO certified which Lilpartybox seeems to be putting the most importance on.
I can honestly say I may not agree with his consensus that ISO certified automatically spells quantity in part!
One only has to look at Rota who has been ISO 9001 for over 30 years now yet their rims can and do break when struck rather than always bending . What is more crash worthy a bent wheel or a wheel that cracks and breaks ? That is left up to you to consider.
Of course I will add Rota is now getting into the flow formed game which should bring a much better product as flow formed is much better than cast.

C. Hank while being nice even in his own discussions seems to be pushing larger rotors for the sake of looks i.e. form over function. THAT to me throws up warning flags about TEI in general as they really are not approaching it from a functioning engineering aspect.

Given all of this , I would buy the product from Ron before buying the product directly because all go backs and issues would be dealt with someone here in the U.S.

I am not sure any of you are aware what it’s like to buy products direct from China in bulk and dealing with Chinese companies in general. Things can change fast and overnight . I am not saying everything out of China is garbage it’s not . I am saying it has been the wild west of capitalism over there for the last 15-20 years and it’s an anything goes situation.

Companies are willing to manufacture say 2000 pieces of something for anyone as long as it’s paid for regardless of if the product is sold . I.E. you buy it you own it end of story . Warranties are great as long as they are exercised properly .

Back in the day I worked for an auto parts wholesaler who sold a crap company with a lifetime warranty on water pumps . Warranty amounted to shit because products broke and needed to be replaced. Guess what not was warrantied? Time and expenses to remove and replace said product .

One has to look at all of this before investing in a product or trusting a product and guess what again has nothing to do with ISO certification. A company can still make crap on a ISO certified facility . It’s not the be all end all statement to quality that some here seem to place.
I cannot stop reiterating that point because I feel it’s so lost on some here.

So all in all I would not buy from TEI.

B. I've never stated that ISO guarantees quality. Nothing can. Only that it decreases the odds of issues like the calipers we've seen in this thread. It's like when my kids were young. If they know the parental units can walk in on them at any moment, they behave. But without supervision, they would likely get into mischief.

The governing bodies that are ISO , TUV, etc can only keep a watchful eye periodically, but that's often enough for a good company to be mindful of what they build and how they go about it. Again, QC in any form can only do so much.

Things are still built by imperfect humans guaranteeing that there will be some mistakes - or even outright corner cutting. QC certs are an attempt to mitigate this. Would you rather no QC at all?

C. I have to agree on you with this one. Vanity shouldn't be the driving force behind brake kit design. And I agree that having a US distributor provides some piece of mind. As we've seen with Ron taking care of our guys whenever there's an issue.

Okay, I'm a push back here.

You say China capitalism is the Wild West in that "anything goes". And I completely agree.

So while some things have TEI branded parts on them, we have *no idea* if the production facility that makes the TEI calipers: 1) stops the line after making TEI's parts 2) starts it back up to make their "own calipers" reusing TEI's specs but just speeding up the line to breakneck speeds 3) slapping TEI branded parts on the pieces of the kit they don't manufacturer (e.g. the pads) 4) drop ship selling them for companies like Whoosh who don't have the capability to do surprise inspections at the facility

And of course Hank is going to push bigger calipers. Go to the big forged rim companies and demand a 16x8 or 15in rim for their biggest lines and get laughed out of the room. If you want 15 or 16in forged wheels, you're going to pay a lot of money because only custom shops are going to make them. Most don't make them below 18, full stop. So TEI is looking at the market and they see people willing to drop serious money on BBKs are the ones with 17+in rims. That's just how capitalism/productions works. So of course Hank is gonna be like "please buy the bigger calipers, [because we don't want to make smaller ones]".

For clarity: *I'm agreeing with everything you're saying on not trusting TEI Racing because we don't have visibility on their process*. Which is why @LilPartyBox and I agree that TEI sponsoring a race team (ideally a lightly modified FWD vehicle) would go miles in proving whether their BBK holds up or not. I just don't agree with how you took opinions and presented them as facts.

We agree on not trusting TEI enough to just throw their BBKs on our rides without them jumping through a lot of hoops. ISO is just the first step. Sponsoring a team and seeing the results is the big one for me.

p.s. props to you on the Rota observation which again reinforces the sponsorship with a race team; i steered clear of their cast wheels because of tuners like you @Dpro which is also why i stopped trying to coordinate a group buy for Titan7 forged wheels (apparently they too break under heavy load in track conditions)

I hadn't thought about the economics behind suggesting bigger rotors by default. You make a good point. I reached out to iForged a few years back about a 17" wheel and the guy sounded shocked. Took him forever but he eventually quoted it. But it still makes me question TEI's focus on actual performance. They need to put their kit on a track somewhere.

After reading all of this, IF I ever had the overwhelming desire to put a fixed caliper kit on my ride, I will save up very slowly, and get the M-Sport R2 AP Racing, or Alcon gravel setup, which I know will go inside every wheel I own, or ever will own, without any spacers.

Added to my list! While I have and would run a spacer, I would love it if I didn't have to.