I think transmission rattles in my car are coming into full bloom now. Anyone recon this sounds obnoxious enough to take to dealership again? DMF shitting the bed?
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdOWn6CEieU
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More transmission rattles - SOLVED
- Thread starter foodtruck
- Start date
OP
Thread Starter
#6
Thread Starter
#6
You may have seen a few of my posts about NVH... engine just feels more buzzy for the last year or so, more vibrations through steering wheel, etc, revving it up just doesn't feel so good anymore (got all 3 mounts changed, muted things down a bit but not too much)... More like whine rather than whoosh. I think there's some sort of resonance around 3k, which also seems to depend on whether the engine has been driven around for a bit and warmed up. It was nothing that I was able to point out to the tech tho, thats why I'm kind of happy it's failing in a more distinct fashion now.
OP
Thread Starter
#7
Thread Starter
#7
Alright, so... went to my original dealership, who brushed me off saying the car sounds fine. After that, tried another one, which was a vastly improved experience. Foreman offered to give it a listen before booking anything, brought tech out, and they both heard the rattle.
Got my car back today. Apparently they found a busted throwout bearing and warrantied that, along with labour. They also replaced the flywheel and the clutch on my request, for which I had to pay for myself.
TLDR;
I took the old parts home and this is what it sounds like:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S4f8ZKrvcuw
According the them, the flywheel was just worn out. At least as far as springs go, it's plausible. I do not baby the car and it did not go out in a spectacular fashion all of a sudden, the rattle started as more pronounced clunking and then got worse over time. I'm somewhat surprised that the surface is so seared, since I don't really do burnouts our hard launches. The diaphragm seems a touch oily on the inside... The techs didn't notice any leaks, so I wonder if it could be the grease from the busted throwout bearing? Unfortunately they didn't save the bearing itself so I can't really check.
New clutch feels incredibly light and I find it way tougher to sense the engagement spot. It's almost like I could ... lean on the old clutch more.
That being said,
There's still some clunk which now sounds more like a thump if I botch up the engagement or disengage clutch when reversing, but its way more muted and limited.
The bad news is that's just what our flywheels do. If I still have the car after this one wears out as well, I'm definitely putting in a single mass one.
---
Attaching some bonus pics of the flywheel and the clutch, would love to hear if this is an example of abused clutch or not. The car is my first manual! EDIT: this is at 50k miles, mostly city
Got my car back today. Apparently they found a busted throwout bearing and warrantied that, along with labour. They also replaced the flywheel and the clutch on my request, for which I had to pay for myself.
TLDR;
- Our cars clunk right out of the factory on clutch engagement/disengagement; that's just DMF
- Rattles on idle like this (NOT the regular direct injection noises) View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w06Kj0yvoHI
- Sounds kind of like this when engaging clutch: View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2DIWCQfNHLo
- Starts off subtle, then over time slowly deteriorates into a major rattle.
- It's NOT the RMM! (although one would definitely help in other ways, still feel engine moving back and forth)
I took the old parts home and this is what it sounds like:
According the them, the flywheel was just worn out. At least as far as springs go, it's plausible. I do not baby the car and it did not go out in a spectacular fashion all of a sudden, the rattle started as more pronounced clunking and then got worse over time. I'm somewhat surprised that the surface is so seared, since I don't really do burnouts our hard launches. The diaphragm seems a touch oily on the inside... The techs didn't notice any leaks, so I wonder if it could be the grease from the busted throwout bearing? Unfortunately they didn't save the bearing itself so I can't really check.
New clutch feels incredibly light and I find it way tougher to sense the engagement spot. It's almost like I could ... lean on the old clutch more.
That being said,
- Rattle is gone
- Cluch chatter on starting in 1st is gone
- Excessive clunks on tip-in in 3rd, 4th, 5th gears are almost gone (but still there if you really listen)
- Engine revs up way quicker and feels more eager
- Vibrations at 3k+ RPM are gone, engine feels smooth again.
- When revving the engine out, I now actually hear the distinct DI machine gun noises like in the other cars I've been in.
There's still some clunk which now sounds more like a thump if I botch up the engagement or disengage clutch when reversing, but its way more muted and limited.
The bad news is that's just what our flywheels do. If I still have the car after this one wears out as well, I'm definitely putting in a single mass one.
---
Attaching some bonus pics of the flywheel and the clutch, would love to hear if this is an example of abused clutch or not. The car is my first manual! EDIT: this is at 50k miles, mostly city
Attachments
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Gunk on the friction material all caked up. Discoloration and evidence of overheating on the metal surface. Look at the pictures on this page:
https://www.sachsperformance.com/en/sachs-service-clutch-slips
https://www.sachsperformance.com/en/sachs-service-clutch-slips
That clutch definitely looks abused. If your throwout bearing had grease in it and it failed then yes it would get on pressure plate clutch surface and flywheel and make it look like that in my opinion. Combined with being a first time clutch driver kinda par for the course. lol
I remember how my first clutch looked and I learned how to drive clutch on it trial by fire. Bought the car jumped in it and just started driving it till I learned. Learned about not riding it as in not taking it out of gear take your damn foot off the clutch pedal period! Thats what dead pedal areas are for. Put your foot there! lol Its really easy to get lazy and let your foot rest lightly on the pedal thinking your not depressing it its ok. But that is what kills throwout bearings and causes mild ride the clutch damage. Don’t ride the clutch .
Once a person learns proper clutch technique the clutch can last the life of the car unless you dump it and spin your tires all over the place. lol Though even with some of that with proper clutch etiquette in between it will still last well past 50K .
I was right there with you I did my first clutch in in 50K . After that it was like clutch is fine drive the car foot off pedal we good. Clutches then lasted long time unless I bought the car used and got someone else’s clutch then it could be iffy.Also when I started making performance mods for more power thats when clutches could be toasted faster. At that point it was beefier clutch time.
Ah I ramble but its all to make a point. You will do better with this next clutch I am sure.
I remember how my first clutch looked and I learned how to drive clutch on it trial by fire. Bought the car jumped in it and just started driving it till I learned. Learned about not riding it as in not taking it out of gear take your damn foot off the clutch pedal period! Thats what dead pedal areas are for. Put your foot there! lol Its really easy to get lazy and let your foot rest lightly on the pedal thinking your not depressing it its ok. But that is what kills throwout bearings and causes mild ride the clutch damage. Don’t ride the clutch .
Once a person learns proper clutch technique the clutch can last the life of the car unless you dump it and spin your tires all over the place. lol Though even with some of that with proper clutch etiquette in between it will still last well past 50K .
I was right there with you I did my first clutch in in 50K . After that it was like clutch is fine drive the car foot off pedal we good. Clutches then lasted long time unless I bought the car used and got someone else’s clutch then it could be iffy.Also when I started making performance mods for more power thats when clutches could be toasted faster. At that point it was beefier clutch time.
Ah I ramble but its all to make a point. You will do better with this next clutch I am sure.
OP
Thread Starter
#14
Thread Starter
#14
Thanks for the feedback! I got the car with 4k miles on it, so gonna blame previous owner 
I have to say, I did not expect new clutch to be as tricky; way less resistance than the old one. I was also wrong about chatter being gone, it does still chatter briefly starting in first. Is that something to be expected while the clutch is breaking in?
I have to say, I did not expect new clutch to be as tricky; way less resistance than the old one. I was also wrong about chatter being gone, it does still chatter briefly starting in first. Is that something to be expected while the clutch is breaking in?
OP
Thread Starter
#15
Thread Starter
#15
If anyone is interested, I cracked the flywheel open; here's what's inside.
The two pieces were held together by the two small rivets in the middle you can see on the previous photos. I suppose it doesn't really matter because there are also 6 bolts going through there as well when the wheel is attached to the engine.
It's a bit hard to see from this view, but there are actually two springs in each of the 4 segments in each of the 3 groups - the outside one of larger diameter and the inside one of smaller one. When I try to move them by hand, they are very snug. If the top plate is back in, however, there's a clear slack, so looks like either the springs were shrinking or the plastic inserts were compressing/wearing out.
One more interesting detail is the very visible metal coloration on the circumference of the wheel. What I first thought was the result me riding the clutch turned out to be just weld marks
The two pieces were held together by the two small rivets in the middle you can see on the previous photos. I suppose it doesn't really matter because there are also 6 bolts going through there as well when the wheel is attached to the engine.
It's a bit hard to see from this view, but there are actually two springs in each of the 4 segments in each of the 3 groups - the outside one of larger diameter and the inside one of smaller one. When I try to move them by hand, they are very snug. If the top plate is back in, however, there's a clear slack, so looks like either the springs were shrinking or the plastic inserts were compressing/wearing out.
One more interesting detail is the very visible metal coloration on the circumference of the wheel. What I first thought was the result me riding the clutch turned out to be just weld marks
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